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No need to read... very long story of what brought me to ALL...
(12-26-2013, 06:07 AM)EveWasFramed Wrote:
(12-25-2013, 12:31 PM)lostatsea Wrote: Do I want someone like her in my life? Can I just be friends with her and get past that?

No. Unfortunately, that's the way obsession works. I can't stress enough - NO CONTACT.
Also, don't you get tired of being used? You're a decent person and no one has the right to use you as their mental/emotional sounding board when they don't have anyone else to talk to. It's cruel of her to use you in such a way, given she KNOWS how you feel/felt about her.
She is thoughtless and couldn't care any less about you, obviously.
I'm sorry, but this is a situation that won't change unless you cut her COMPLETELY out of your life.
I read all ten pages of the thread (at various times) but was hesitant to post because you obviously weren't ready to let go.
I think you might be ready now. For your own sake, let go....

+100
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I know you guys are right. After two months I finally got past being completely obsessed only to have her pop back up. I told her I was visiting family the last few days, which I am, but I wouldn't have access to a computer. But even after avoiding her the last few days I find myself thinking about her more and more. This thing is definitely toxic. I realized it a while ago. I also realize every time she's come to me she's been feeling down because unlike her other friends she knows I do care. But at the same time, it's still an obsession, and completely unhealthy. She's living a completely different life to one that I would or could ever live. I think back to the letter she wrote her future self about how she knew there was a wild side coming. I remember talking to her about how if she wanted she could have an endless string of guys, and she said she knew and was scared. That's exactly what happened. She's part of that new breed of liberal teenagers who view sex as just a fun activity, and very casual. Having sex with a new guy is part of the getting to know you process, and she's had a scary number of partners in the last few months. She's living the life of the stereotypical college student you see on tv, always wanting to be drunk, partying, and having fun. Which is exactly what she should be doing. Living life the way she wants to, in whichever way she chooses.

But for an inexperienced lonely person that just fuels jealousy and regret. I need to move on like I was doing. I know she'll be just fine without me, and hopefully I will be too.
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Something you will need to do....

Fix it so she CANT "pop back up" at any time. Change your number, remove her from anywhere she can contact you at. Obsession is similar in nature to addiction. You must remove the source of the obsession/addiction. I wish you much luck - I know it's going to be very difficult. *hug*
“Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, ‘I will try again tomorrow.’”
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As adamant as I felt about just moving on. Time, loneliness, and a sleepless late night haunted me. I couldn't help but talk to the girl on skype again. As heartbroken as she appeared when she needed to ask me for advice she seems to be just fine again. Not all that sad about the british man she felt so strong about a week and a half ago. This girl bounces around like crazy with her emotions. I'm not going to be stupid and say she's a sociopath or has some mental illness. But I will say she's extremely emotional and bounces between extremes.

This girl is a drama queen with her emotions. She feels so strongly over things and then rewrites history. All those times she felt terrible and I was there helping her feel better never happened. She said she's never been sad around me. She would talk about feeling so terrible, so lonely, and empty inside. Listening to sad songs, feeling heartbroken, and unfulfilled, with tears streaming down her face. All that time, she was never sad.

She told me stories about what's been going on in life, particularly new years, and how she's having so much fun with this new irish guy she met. How nonchalantly they've been hanging out all the time, and he's really hilarious. All his friends are just as hilarious, and she feels good around them. They just drink and party all the time, and of course her and the irish have lots of sex. The hilarious thing is Irish's best friend constantly tries to get with her too, like heavy flirting, and the irish guy knows and doesn't care. She gave the best friend a NYE kiss because she felt bad for him. They are the perfect friends she's been looking for. Laid back, drinking all the time, and can just make her laugh continuously. Unlike some of the other people she's had relations with, these people are actually age appropriate for her as well.

This girl is one of those mythical heartbreakers. I liken her to a siren from greek mythology. She just draws people to her with her mannerisms and personality because she does have a fun one. Likes to make jokes, witty, and deceptively intelligent. That's matched with a very flirty, seductive attitude, that matches her willingness to jump into bed soon after meeting someone and her proficiency in the bed. They say scorpios are addicting and she really is. She's left a few guys completely emotionally shocked in the last few months as she suddenly left them after appearing interested. I've been locked in on her for almost two years now because my deficiencies make me particularly susceptible.

Every time I talk to her I feel terrible after. I have this constant regret about how I lived my life. In many ways I've watched this girl grow up. Seeing this girl, spending so much time with her, getting close to her, as she lived the same boring life, and then watching her grow up is painful. I'm seeing what happens when somebody grows up and starts living a real life. I'm seeing what I wish I could have done when I was in college, and come out of my shell. Hell if I could do it now, with half the effectiveness she has I'd be completely ecstatic. Last year she called me on NYE to come talk about how she got a nice talk and kiss on the forehead. This year it was two straight days of drinking, partying, and sex. Even tonight she is talking about how it's Friday night, she needs to wait for Irish and his best friend to come pick her up so they can party. Months ago she would email me to come talk and hang out on Friday nights... and every night. Now she's up all night with real people making real friendships and real memories. The stupidest thing is its still the same thing it was four months ago. I don't even really "like" who this girl is anymore. She's given up some of her biggest positive traits after she moved on from me. I feel like I myself am reaching an extreme. The more I hate the way I lived life, the more I wished I lived a crazy one like hers, because I know she isn't living the typical life by any means either.

I know lost time can never be found. I know I should be happy for this girl finally living a life she deems worthy. At the same time her popping up again has placed me right back to where I was months ago. I never stopped hating my life but seeing her live hers brings it to the forefront. I look back at this thread and it makes me ashamed of how weak I am and how bad this thing has turned out. January 3rd and I've already broken the resolution to finally move one. I think about why I even bother updating this thread as it really doesn't do anything to help me. But I guess I hope one day I'll look back and see how far I've come. Maybe one day somebody will stumble upon it, and realize as weak as they were over their situation, there was a guy out there was was so much weaker over a far dumber one.

I'm having a mental evaluation on Sunday. At this point I want them to find something wrong with me. I want an excuse for why I can't just be an adult and real person who can simply do what he knows needs to be done. I want drugs. I want something that will make me feel empowered to change when my own mind hasn't allowed me to do anything in months.
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So I felt terrible after writing that last post. I went on skype and talked to someone from ALL for a long while. Decided this is really going crazy. The New Year just started and I'm living like it was a year ago. I know Eve was right, but I was just too afraid to do it. I realized that I need to nip this in the bud NOW. I tried just blocking her and not saying anything, but I would eventually just unblock her like I have. I need to make it impossible to talk to her again, and impossible to talk to her in the future.

I had another dramatic talk with her. Explained everything and asked her to never contact me again. She actually fought me to keep talking to her, which felt good but I realize it is just because I was the one saying we're done. If I never talked to her she could randomly be upset and gladly tell me to never talk to her again tomorrow. In the end her tone went from, no keep talking to me, to i don't care at all. But she said she wouldn't contact me again. Hopefully she makes good on that.
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(01-04-2014, 09:32 PM)lostatsea Wrote: Hopefully she makes good on that.

For your own good, make it where she CANT - don't leave it up to her.
“Courage doesn't always roar. Sometimes courage is the quiet voice at the end of the day saying, ‘I will try again tomorrow.’”
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I read it...and that's all I have to say:

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5:37 AM. I've been up for a while unable to sleep anymore. A lot of thoughts weighing on my mind.

I went to the initial evaluation today and spoke with a psychiatrist at the #4 rated psychiatry hospital in the country. I was excited to talk to someone and have actually been looking forward to the appointment like a child looks forward to disneyland. The hour flew by and I felt like I barely got to speak about anything. The initial impression the doctor received is that I have a highly addictive personality, I'm avoidant, afraid, and I've been depressed for a very long time. The fact that I've been isolating myself so much has amplified everything making me socially starved. She will however have to meet me again to get a better impression and make a more accurate assessment.

The funny thing is I of course told the doctor about this ridiculous girl situation and she wasn't very worried about it. She said the girl is an extreme stressor in my life. But is merely a symptom of the bigger problem. That as I improve my life in other areas, the girl problem would fade away on its own. She said she thinks anti depressants would help but are not required. Otherwise she said she is sure I will not be able to improve on my own and that I would need help. She thinks I should attend a day treatment program where I talk to a bunch of other people for a few weeks.

I'm not sure how I feel about the laissez faire attitude toward the girl. The past week I was reading up on mental disorders and in doing so I came across Borderline Personality Disorder. As I read more and more about it, everything over the course of the last two years started making sense. All the dots started getting connected, and every weird thing, and even not weird thing started becoming symptoms. She fits the criteria for having it. Her entire extended family is predisposed to mental disorders and addictions. Her parents are divorced and she told me how she had to make peace with not having a mother in her life. At the same time her dad and brother with aspergers constantly fight, and she has a turbulent relationship with her family. BPD people cannot control their emotions. Instead of going from 1 to 100 like most people they go from -1000 to 1000. It's like feeling every emotion you've ever felt all at once all the time. It leaves this constant feeling of turmoil as your emotions are constantly fighting each other. The moodiness, irrational behavior, anger, sadness, feeling of emptiness, loneliness, idealization, devaluation etc. I of course am not trained to give any form of diagnosis, but she has so many of the symptoms that I would bet money she has BPD or something closely related.

The tell tale sign of BPD is trouble in relationships. BPDs are in love with love, and just want to be loved. They are also deathly afraid of abandonment. It is not unusual for a BPD sufferer to do a push/pull where they constantly say bye/hello again and again, like a revolving door. They mirror those that they are closest to, matching their ideals, beliefs, and behaviors. They just want the people closest to them to love them and fill that hole. When she moved on from me, she stopped mirroring me. BPD people often become alcoholics and drug abusers as well as it helps them cope with the turmoil inside them. Suddenly her behavior change and wanting to be drunk and have sex all the time made sense. Often in BPD people, they relate sex and intimacy to be love, so they constantly crave it, and use it as a tool to ensnare people. It is said the beginning period of a BPD relationship is the best experience a person will have in their life. I mean the more and more I read about BPD the more little things started matching up.

But here's the problem. BPD when untreated gets worse and worse as the highs and lows get bigger. BPD is a vacuous emotional hole that will suck everything a person has, so much so there are support groups for people who have come in contact with a BPD sufferer whether it be a spouse, sibling, friend, etc. They try to leave but it's like they're addicted to the BPD sufferer, so they just keep getting drawn back in. One of the most dangerous aspects of BPD is that it has a very high risk of suicide. 10% of BPD sufferers end up committing suicide. I can only think back to that email, saying "You don't have to reply, but I think I might do something stupid, and just needed to tell someone." Was that a precursor to what might eventually happen?

That's the question that will haunt me. I believe this girl is a high functioning BPD, as in she is able to hide the symptoms from the outside world. She used to tell me how her best friends weren't allowed to meet each other. I thought it was weird but it only made sense after I found out about BPD. She mirrors them, and since they are different, she acts completely differently with each one. So they don't think anything is wrong. She's just a wild college girl living a DGAF life.

The symptoms only really come out at home, with family, lovers, etc. I know for a long time this girl emotionally relied on me. Even that email at Christmas she wanted to speak to me because she was feeling heartbroken. She showed me that love letter and said who knew she had it in her. She didn't even bother showing her a friend, and said she's not an emotional person 99% of the time, only when alone. I've never met a more emotional person in my life, yet her friends don't think she emotional at all. Suddenly it made sense why she kept coming back to me again and again. When she's feeling really down and emotional, I'm the only person she talks to. She cried in front of a friend she's known since she was two and the friend just told her to stop it.

I already told her to not contact me again weeks ago, and by many accounts I was lucky to get away as people who deal with BPD end up thinking they're crazy themselves, and yet are unable to escape the hooks of the BPD sufferer. But the guilt is there. This girl always knew there was something going on in her. I've seen her personal tumblr posts, I've seen the constant sadness, and I've seen her soundtrack to life. Before she moved on she was listening to songs about me saving her soul, and being afraid of the darkness inside her. She thought I was gone for good, and started listening to songs about not seeing what I saw inside her, and being consumed by evil. Now she listens to Disturbed - Down with sickness, innocence lost, and being paranoid.

I didn't cause this, yet at the same time I'm the only one right now who even suspects something could be wrong. But she wouldn't listen to me if I tried talking to her. The last time I talked to she rewrote the past and said all the sad times never happened. She was never sad. I used to think she was a liar, but she really believes it. Her denial has rewritten history. She blamed me for projecting any issues on her. I mentioned she was crazy once in a joking way and she got seriously offended. I've been on BPD forums and they said you NEVER confront a person with BPD about having BPD. They live in strong denial and someone telling them they are legitimately crazy will only make things worse, and they will hate the person. Something needs to happen in the persons mind that just clicks and they realize something might be wrong. Instead you're supposed to be a friend, and support them as best you can, without ever directly stating anything about being sick. Plus she is loving life right now. She has the Irish guy and it's going great. They've been on their thing for a month and she is sleeping over often. She is going out to raves, and parties, and meeting new people. Life is better than ever for her.

I know she could really use a stable anchor who is a good influence on her. But I can't be that person without losing myself. I still find myself getting anxious and checking her twitter periodically. Just today she tweeted "I have too much love to give and I swear it'll be my downfall.", "Girl, you are going to break with a heart like that." "I'd like to know that your love Is love I can be sure of... will you still love me tomorrow?" Little does she know how right she is. Those are the emotions that will lead a BPD down the road to emotional oblivion.

I saw this so early and there is nothing I can do to help her. It could be years or decades before she even realizes there's a problem. What if one day I find out she committed suicide? I am so haunted by this. I've contemplated things I could do. Talking to her directly is out of the question. Talking to her parents would be near impossible as well. Hi, I'm a random guy on the internet who was talking to your significantly younger daughter for the last two years. I know your daughter seems happier than ever lately, and in a lot ways her life is going great. You don't know it, but your daughter suffers from a mental disorder. Also you can't talk to your daughter directly about it, and mentioning me would just infuriate her too. There is just no solution for this other that to move on live my life, let her live hers, and hope things work out for her.
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I've been taking all of this in the last couple of days and I find myself awake in the middle of the night unable to sleep again. The more I read about BPD and those attracted to BPDs the more I realize how silly the last 2 years of my life have been. It's like seeing all the pieces of the puzzle being aligned into a clear picture, giving me a better understanding of not only her but myself.

How could a girl so easily allow herself to spend this much time and open up her entire life to someone across the country, who she hasn't even seen? I used to think it was unusual for people to be able to talk as much as we did. That on some level there was a special connection. In some ways it is. I mean at least for me it is. I don't want to spend that much time with most people, but with her time just disappeared instantly. But I realize now, that's just who she is. BPD sufferers mirror the person, allow themselves to be slightly vulnerable, and boost the target's sense of self, all to draw them in.

But why me? I'm far more receptive than most people. I've got a white knight syndrome. My self esteem is low, so I boost it by rescuing the damsel in distress. This girl came back again and again, when she was feeling down, asking for help. It gives me a feeling of self worth knowing that I'm helping her. That I'm the one she came to for help. This signifies codependency issues. The girl once asked me what I was passionate about. What would make happy? It really bugged me, because in the end I didn't have an answer. She joked that I was afraid to say that she was what would make me happy. But at the time it was true. The thing that made me the happiest, was knowing that I had gotten her out of that constant cloak of sadness. That my entire basis of happiness was her happiness. This doesn't sound inherently bad, but the codependent becomes so focused on the other person, they stop living their own life. That's why even after months of not speaking to her, she can suddenly find a way to message me and all of a sudden my head and emotions get wrapped in a fog all over again. That is actually stereotypical of a BPD. They call it the push/pull. They will always go back to the people they think that reaffirm their value, and give them adoration and affection if the person allows them too. Which is why it usually takes several tries before a BPD is truly gone.

Knowing what I know now, and being through the thick of it should give me peace of mind. Me being so sure this girl is a high functioning BPD should make me HAPPY I've seen the light and have gotten away. A healthy minded individual would have moved on and never looked back in September. This girl if left untreated will end up on a rollercoaster of an emotional life, and drag down anybody unfortunate enough to get close to her. She will go from thinking she is completely in love with people like the Brit to completely heartbroken, and then suddenly find herself in a happy relationship days later. In the last few months I've seen her repeatedly get sad as she bounced from guy to guy only to recover fairly quickly. I forget that only 2 weeks before she first met the Brit she was completely sad and missing me. Her love, and affection are based on things other than actual love and will change like the weather.

Why then does the idea of her still make me sad? Maybe it's because I watched her grow up and feel a bond, however fake it was. Maybe it's because she knows something is inside her that she refuses to admit in public, but she thought I could save her. But maybe it's because I'm actually jealous of her, because even though I know all the possible pitfalls that might befall her in the future, the last several months she has been living life by her terms. She's been out having fun, making memories, meeting people, and actually living. While I've been mostly trapped in my head for the same time.

Maybe it's the fact that I know that even though she's mirroring, she's still a fun person to be around. Maybe it's the fact that she still has all those great traits that she always had. Guiltily, maybe it is the fact that I know she's an uninhibited sexual addict who wants nothing more than to please her man all the time. It is said the honeymoon phase with a girl with a BPD, is the best time a person will have in their life. But it's the heaven before the hell. BPD sufferers, use sex like a weapon to control and hook their counterparts before putting them through emotional and mental torture. Knowing all this I still find myself incredibly jealous of the Irishman. Maybe it's the fact that I have nothing else with little to look forward to in the immediate future. I can improve myself, but it will be a long difficult process.

I had this feeling of worry about her. But the reality is, she's living a full life. I'm the one living a shell of one. Which shows just how codependent and depressed I have become. I can't save her. What would I be saving her from? Her life is great right now because maybe what's most important in life, is being happy, period, and she is far happier right now than I am. I need to save myself right now. I need to remind myself of what the reality of the situation is. How stupidly dumb this whole thing was. How even though I've wasted so much time being emotionally torn over this girl I am lucky to have gotten out. That this wasn't normal, and unfortunately neither were her or my mindsets. In ten years she might unfortunately be living in BPD hell but I can still be living in harmony and bliss.
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