]]the dread of the failing methadone system: prayers, hugs, hope, anything plz

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simhthmss

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methadone drs are harsh people, the surgeries treat them like gods as theyre rarely in so they have HUGE superiority complexes as many patients also fall for their mind games, they sit there not looking directly at you with a 'youre just a dirty smack head and im a prestigious doctor' look about them and a grin like they own the planet reclining back in a giant chair (you get a lower plastic one) twiddling their pens, they have the power to reduce your dose considerable and REALLY make you suffer and the f'ing well know it, that's the seat of their psychological power, they are also usually psychiatrists! thay are NOT even MD's who have specialized in pharmacology, they are just shrinks who have read some books on the psychology of addiction but clearly have no idea what it is like.

most on methadone grovel and simper before them sort of begging not to reduce their dose as just 5mg less means months of suffering.

the problem is i lost full and complete trust in the addiction treatment system when i spoke to many many addicts over time and i myself found this to be true, you can quit morphine/ heroin in about 2 weeks and be fine but methadone withdrawal is so excruciatingly painful you simply cant quit for a day, it is beyond anything it is reasonabe to expect someone to cope with....every addict ive known had said ; i can quit heroin but methadone is pure torture' and the scheme of replacing the less addictive morphine youre on with the MORE addictive methadone has a 95% failure rate by their own admission, that put a big dent in my trust in this scheme and considering methadone has existed since the 40's and morphine has been around forever in its plant form i think the drug companies and drs and anyone who knows anything about pharmacology knows you're better just quitting morphine cold turkey than ever ever getting on methadone, before i started many warned me its a one way street i'll never leave and they are **** welll right then the biggest thing to smash any trust i have in these guys is the drug companies tell them it is more addictive than morphine/heroin but the drug company lobbies who insist their brand name oy methadone 'physeptone' is prescribed 'donate' to the NHS with the intent to make sure that methadone programs are thriving and everywhere and policy isnt changed so they can deal their impossible to quit uber opiates to everyone

then i found out that for every methadone patient a dr 'creates' they get £1000 'funding' from that nhs drug lobby money paid directly TO THE DOCTOR!' and when i joined naive, not knowing didldy about squat the drs were the first drug pushers i have met in my life, every other drug dealer you chase after them and you do or don't buy it they don't care, someone will buy their stock either way....i have never had an illegal drug 'pushed' on me until i got into the clutches of a methadone clinic where they lied like hell to get me addicted to their drugs; treated me all nice, told me methadone can be seamlessly tapered (lie) and it'll be great, and that its less addictive than opiates (lie) with a high sucesss rate (lie) and blah de blah.

these days however after 5 years alone with stacks and stacks of medical and pharmacology books phd clinical pharmacologists read i know more about receptor sites, the science of addiction at a neurological, level and the effects of each opiate on the delta, kappa mu, and nop opioid receptor sites and how their structure as an organic or in some cases non organic structure effects these sites and the rest of the body works than they ever will as a psychiatrist that's just specialized in addiction psychiatry which is all these dudes are.

see these guys once they have hooked you try screw with you, they dont treat you like a normal dr would as to them im the dumbass smack head and hes the genius remember?

so these appointments are like mental chess games and most get confused buckle under and do whatever they're told but now i know more than them i can engage them in these chess matches they to try to 'catch you out' with and usually win.

for example i will saw very clearly and loudly 2 feet from them i used WEED the other day for my back pain and they'll say very fast (this one was Egyptian so he'd put on a thicker accent to do this) and say very quickly' 'youhadsome crack?' and if you arent playing the game of chess....youre tired or are having a bad day or thought he was confirming you had a little bit of medicinal weed and answered yes...they will have in your permanent file that you relapsed and went on a crack binge!

i have never had addictive problems with crack, done it a bit, not told them and didnt get hooked, as far as theyre concearned ive never tried it and i keep it need to know as you say the wrong thing and they will twist it in to the most ridiculous thing they can get away with

ive even had times where i just mentioned i was stressed out because i was stuck in the horrible shared house i was in and they were always making too much noise and partying too much...the usual stuff u get from inconsiderate housemates and you know what he put on my PERMINANT RECORD? when at the time i hadnt touched an addictive non medicinal drug in years?
he entered into the system that for 3 years to the present day (at that time) i was living in a CRACK HOUSE!!! yup a noisey shared house got warped and written down as literally me squatting illegally in a crack house with dealers and hookers and stuff!

so when you go in there it is a game of chess not a dr trying to help you but a dr that is:

1)trying to find a way to force you to consent to reducing your methadone script and being in chronic pain the result of that would be less methadone to keep my endorphin level as a reasonable level and thus a severe sensitivity to pain which would simply result in me either doing myself in from the pain or taking opium tea again to kill the pain as at the moment i and holding onto everything with my very fingernails, anymore pain and something's GOT to give,

2)trying to get you to say things they can twist into things that look bad on your record, anything to get a power advantage over you, having the power to make someones life a misery with painful withdrawals off a drug they tricked you on to is quite a power trip for someone who is a psychopath or severely twisted or sadistic and in these parts that kind of job attracts that kinda person, the same way the tsa attracts some people who enjoy grabbing peoples nuts...if youre an addict elsewhere they might be nice up your way....they are not round my area.

i gotta get up at 9 and i need 10 hours sleep a night and now i will only get 4 hours i willl be a zombie and in agony i wont be able to 'play chess' and i have been moved to a different clinic with a doctor i do not know or have even met i am severely depressed, in extreme pain and just do not want to lower my script as that will mean more pain due to which i will personally have to either self medicate or give the material world up....her goal will be to try to trip me up,....the 60ml a day they give me has me agonizingly withdrawing 5 hours a day before the dose is due as it is but if i start taking it early its obvious that will lead to taking it earlier and earlier

her goal will be to take some off my script and i just cant cope with that i need to keep it, it barely works at the dose it is at. but shes new i dont know what approach she will attempt to take.... willl it be the superior approach, the 'welll im concerned you've been on that dose a long time' approach, the 'im very nice and will pretend i care to lure you into reduction approach, i dunno what to expect, i'll be sleep deprived, this will be HELL tomorrow. theres a 1 in 10,000 chance I'll get one that appreciates i am very sick and just need to be left alone as i am barely alive these days unless i get what i NEED to fix ALL this illness and it isnt a drug

i am deeply dreading this, my spirit tells me it'll go bad, my brain agrees, i feel like i have an appointment with an executioner tomorrow NOT a doctor :'-( please if you believe in any form of positive deity (no disrespect but if you are a satanist or luciferian...no prayers for me to that dude thank you) or just believe you can direct positive force or energy please please direct your good will toward me and basically pray for me? PLEASE?, if pure atheist then maybe a pm with a hug in it? please? infact i could do with those as wel :'-( i am utterly terrified, this person could make my life a living hell at the stroke of a pen
 
Well after 6 treatment centers in 15 years, I finally beat alcohol and drugs... and have 7 years and 43 days sober. And man... don't tell me you DIDN'T know it's was addictive, when you started. If you are so smart why didn't you do the research before you put something in your body ? Isn't that your responsibility ?

I have studied the addicted brain and psychology for 16 years... And Lived in a 28 day Drug/Alcohol treatment center for 2 1/2 years.... 2,300 people came through there while I was their. They had every imaginable ism, addiction, home situation, up bringing, personality types, careers, and so on....

It gave me a wonderful opportunity to witness from a third person perspective ... From Detox, treatment, to release ... And watched many of they come back through, just like I did over the years...

But I started to notice the patterns of behavior in everyone of them.... They ALL... and I mean EVERYONE.... including myself.... And by the way... I study Human anatomy, brain function and cognition, as well as Chemistry too.


I have sat right there next to over 150 people in Detox, coming off of Opiates... Hell I even had to clean the shower, after they honeysuckle themselves ... I watched then rub holes in their jeans right in front of me, because their legs ached so bad.... I've seen projective vomiting, and chills where we had to strap them in bed so they didn't fall out. And I remember when a Brain Surgeon with a addiction to Phenobarbital came through... I spent ALLOT of time with her... She was HOT !! And yeah she's a practicing BRAIN SURGEON !!


http://www.opiates.com/methadone/methadone-addiction.html
Though it has shown success in treating addiction, Methadone itself can be addictive and may require a ((second detox.))...

Tolerance and dependence to Methadone can take hold quickly. While it may be ideal for maintenance therapy, it is ((not the right treatment)) for users looking to become completely ((opiate-free)). Withdrawal symptoms with Methadone are a sure sign of physical dependence. They are considered less severe than with morphine or heroin but last longer, ((sometimes 2 weeks to 6 months)). Methadone withdrawal can cause the following problems: lightheadedness, sneezing, vomiting, delusions, paranoia, elevated blood pressure, suicidal ideation, nausea, diarrhea, fever, chills, aches and pain, tremors, depression, prolonged insomnia, delirium, hallucinations, agitation and anxiety.

http://www.morningsiderecovery.com/addiction-treatment/methadone/
If you’re here, you’re well aware of the havoc associated with drug abuse. Methadone is a drug used to counter the extreme pain and side effects of other narcotic drug withdrawals. Unfortunately, methadone itself is highly addictive and often replaces the drug a user was formerly addicted to, to the detriment and distress of both the user and their loved ones.

Research has demonstrated that long-term methadone use can disrupt the way critical brain structures interact. The brain's reward circuit, which links together a number of brain structures that control and regulate our ability to feel pleasure, is activated by methadone. Just as our skin wrinkles when we receive repeated doses of sunlight, the brain adjusts to the daily bath in opioids by changing the production of certain neurotransmitters and reducing the number of receptors that can receive their signals. This is why abusers eventually feel numb, flat, and depressed, and barely able to motivate themselves to pursue previous goals and dreams.(( Additionally, methadone addiction retards a person's self-development and ability to mature in their attitudes and behaviors.))

And addictive behavior ALWAYS displays it's self the same way..... self deception and irresponsibility . And blame everybody else for their problems. That's the biggest ISM they have... it's the BullShit-ISM, they B.S. themselves right back to a reason to use, and keep using.


I won't say coming of opiates is easy in anyway, it's a ***** !! But since it's listed as a disease, it's treatable. And it's a self induced disease, and it's a self induced recovery... And stopping any addiction is never meant to be easy... you want to know why.... SO YOU DON"T GO BACK AGAIN !!

The Doctors aren't the liar's.... The addict is !! Always, that's how they got the problem in the first place. And refuse to take responsibility for their own actions. ( Go back to the fist paragraph again)The only way to really recover is to Detoxification ... But you have to really want to quit, not get more.
""That means eliminate it from the body... Not put it in it !! And that Chess game you mentioned... is your brain coming up with any excuse to get MORE... And the doctor knows that... and that's why you lose.

And I don't see ONE word of getting support from NA, or any attempt on your part to actually quit. Only how you can get more.....
You said " they are just shrinks who have read some books on the psychology of addiction but clearly have no idea what it is like. "" And you are right there... but they aren't the ones that are addicted, are they ? They are harsh because they deal with 1,000's of people that say the same thing over and over... They have a degree and license for a reason. And they are trying to get you off of it... not keep you on it !!

Well I lived it, learned it, and BEAT it !! And do you think those counselors in the centers, were as nice as a doctor with a script pad ?
So tell me another brother... ( That's rhetorical).. I have heard it all before....Over and over and over and over and over and over and over.......I have been there, done that, and I even have a whole box of employee T-shirts from the Treatment Center still to this day !!
 
well youve made a hell of a lot of false asumptions there i dont know where to begin, i just cant reduce now due to chronic pain, a couple mg reduction sends my pain through the roof, i still withdraw a good few hours a day on what im on now...

i didnt mention the other services as

1)its my business how i deal with this and

2)i wasnt thinking about those services at that time...i go to na, the counciling service and accupunture, its a small surgery and thats everything they offer....and i wont to get in to a conversation about the rest of my life as there are many fasle assumptions here about me and who i am, who i was and i dont talk much about large chunks of who i am on here (only to trusted people on pm) i'll just say you really really dont know me as well as you seem to think you do, infact you know a tiny bit of me that ive tentatively allowed to be known....as when i try to publicly share this kinda thing happens.

and thats it for the thread im not looking at this thread again i just got a bargain on a jacket and shoes and its an achievement for me to enter crowded areas so thats what im focusing on, friends that don't assume things about me without asking can pm me if they have anything to say; for other people who are interested in the outcome i told them how i stay at 60 otherwise it severely lowers my pain threshhold and i get suicidal with chronic pain and have no fear of doing so if its my time to go, but dont like being on it and for now theyre holding at 60mg but im very suspicious of their intentions of them trying to pressure me

to any friends who have wished me well thank you
 
simhthmss said:
well youve made a hell of a lot of false asumptions there i dont know where to begin, i just cant reduce now due to chronic pain, a couple mg reduction sends my pain through the roof, i still withdraw a good few hours a day on what im on now...

i didnt mention the other services as

1)its my business how i deal with this and

2)i wasnt thinking about those services at that time...i go to na, the counciling service and accupunture, its a small surgery and thats everything they offer....and i wont to get in to a conversation about the rest of my life as there are many fasle assumptions here about me and who i am, who i was and i dont talk much about large chunks of who i am on here (only to trusted people on pm) i'll just say you really really dont know me as well as you seem to think you do, infact you know a tiny bit of me that ive tentatively allowed to be known....as when i try to publicly share this kinda thing happens.

and thats it for the thread im not looking at it again, friends that don't assume things about me without asking can pm me if they have anything to say for other people who are interested in the outcome i told them how i stay at 60 otherwise it severely lowers my pain threshhold and i get suicidal with chronic pain and have no fear of doing so if its my time to go, but dont like being on it and for now theyre holding at 60mg but im very suspicious of their intentions of them trying to pressure me

to any friends who have wished me well thank you

Ok ... I am sorry you have chronic pain... I picked up on the methadone addiction.

They are still working on many treatments for chronic pain. But their are so many causes. I my self have develop a very high pain threshold just do to having to face severe periods from accidents.

hank God my drugs or choice were speed... Because I was on pain meds so much I should have gotten hooked on them but didn't.

And your right I don't know you... It's just I had to face some scary truths about myself to get though my addictions. And addictions are my business, not pain management.... Hell I drank so I didn't have to feel anything for 30 years.

So again you are right, I don't know your situation. And I apologize for being harsh.
 
one thing you have to be cautious of is that "pain" you feel may be party ghost pain brought on by the methadone telling you to take more.
I have a few friends that got hooked on oxycontin and that is exactly what it does.
the docs give you oxy to deal with pain from an injury, and then the moment you stop taking it the pain returns. maybe to get rid of the pain you have to get rid of the addiction in small increments?
I have a bad sore back that makes my legs ache and I have constant pain daily, some days when i'm over active it gets a lot worse. but I take absolutely nothing for it. I deal with it because I know that i'd rather have that then an addiction.

i'm not saying that youre case is the same and I don't know your situation, but I am saying that this is a VERY common factor and I will say that most people that are taking meth or oxy's for pain for extended periods.. are long past the original pain source.
 
Alienated said:
Ok ... I am sorry you have chronic pain... I picked up on the methadone addiction.

They are still working on many treatments for chronic pain. But their are so many causes. I my self have develop a very high pain threshold just do to having to face severe periods from accidents.

hank God my drugs or choice were speed... Because I was on pain meds so much I should have gotten hooked on them but didn't.

Not to fan any of the flames here, but I just thought I would add my two cents. I think strong stimulants can cause a lot of problems too, albeit a different set. Once the addiction is done and over with, and it can be years later too, you still don't enjoy things as much as you used to. Boredom happens faster, you can't focus as well, and motivation is very hard to come by.

I'm not saying such a person can use his/her prior addiction as an excuse to not improve, but to me it's sometimes a shame. You work pretty hard to get off the stuff and find that still, even with many sober years behind you, things aren't getting back to normal.
 
Batman55 said:
Alienated said:
Ok ... I am sorry you have chronic pain... I picked up on the methadone addiction.

They are still working on many treatments for chronic pain. But their are so many causes. I my self have develop a very high pain threshold just do to having to face severe periods from accidents.

hank God my drugs or choice were speed... Because I was on pain meds so much I should have gotten hooked on them but didn't.

Not to fan any of the flames here, but I just thought I would add my two cents. I think strong stimulants can cause a lot of problems too, albeit a different set. Once the addiction is done and over with, and it can be years later too, you still don't enjoy things as much as you used to. Boredom happens faster, you can't focus as well, and motivation is very hard to come by.

I'm not saying such a person can use his/her prior addiction as an excuse to not improve, but to me it's sometimes a shame. You work pretty hard to get off the stuff and find that still, even with many sober years behind you, things aren't getting back to normal.

Yes it does take years to get the brain rebalanced to producing it's own reward system at a normal level... But there are many many many methods to decrease that normal period... The Brain is a lot like a muscle... Once it's damaged you give it time to heal, then exercise the crap out of it.

The key depends on replacing the addiction, with something you enjoy and is rewarding, but still healthy. That increases the brains regrowth of neural thought pathways that totally bypass the damaged areas. And the neurons used haven't been effected at all. In doing this you can change your whole thought process to be productive instead of destructive behavior.

And in doing so, it give self worth and value, and encouragement to keep trying harder and harder. And your recovery can become exponentially quickened. And you have a new life, where you think, feel, reason, make decisions, and behave unlike you ever have before. I was able to cut the normal 6 to 7 years of regrowth down to 3 years. And you are free to boot !!
 
Alienated said:
Yes it does take years to get the brain rebalanced to producing it's own reward system at a normal level... But there are many many many methods to decrease that normal period... The Brain is a lot like a muscle... Once it's damaged you give it time to heal, then exercise the crap out of it.

The key depends on replacing the addiction, with something you enjoy and is rewarding, but still healthy. That increases the brains regrowth of neural thought pathways that totally bypass the damaged areas. And the neurons used haven't been effected at all. In doing this you can change your whole thought process to be productive instead of destructive behavior.

And in doing so, it give self worth and value, and encouragement to keep trying harder and harder. And your recovery can become exponentially quickened. And you have a new life, where you think, feel, reason, make decisions, and behave unlike you ever have before. I was able to cut the normal 6 to 7 years of regrowth down to 3 years. And you are free to boot !!


I completely agree with this! The brain is capable of some amazing things.
 
What is it that you have, that causes said chronic pain?

I will tell you something: Drugs are a cover, not a cure. They hide the pain to make the "disease" or "issue" bearable. But it is not a cure.

I have known people who had gone through terrible incidents causing them a lot of pain. When they started to take heavy medications, they RELIED on that medication. Not because they needed it, but because they became so use to it that any amount of pain was excruciating in the end. When we have the body fooled with drugs, our minds believe we cannot cope without said drugs... And thus, we have fooled ourselves into believing we are permanently "broken". (This may not actually apply to you, it's just what I have figured out!)

It's like the placebo effect. People believe the drug is being taken... When really it is something as simple as a vitamin or a water pill. Sometimes, we have to trick our minds, in order for our bodies to feel better. :)

I hope you do feel better eventually.
 
You can cope up with methadone withdrawal. There are psychologist who can support you. And if you think positively you will overcome this addiction. As studies says that response is not only through biological reaction but also psychological reaction. So believe in yourself that you can overcome the symptoms of methadone withdrawal. Over time you will be treated. Do not give up. And trust that medications is there to guide you and support all the way to your treatment. Medications and counseling are the great treatment for your condition. At the end you will be happy with the result of your treatment. And new happiness that you will come your way. As medications are formed to treat illnesses, so just believe and trust the medicines.

*promotion removed*
 

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