There is no such thing as positive eugenics

http://www.roundtree7.com/2011/07/h...-eugenics-movement-and-the-fernald-boys-home/

Try to tell me something like THAT can ever have a positive outcome.
Eugenics is an evil, disgusting religion and anyone who has the slightest praise for the concept ought to be rounded up and dealt with in the appropriate manner.

Yes. I don't think you'll find anyone who will disagree with you concerning that. The philosophy is.. warped. Don't know what else to say really, except people should take a lesson from history and leave certain things well enough alone. But humans never learn..

There are a lot of positive things that can be done with eugenics, just not the kind in that article. It's going to happen either way. The science is starting to get there.

There is absolutely nothing positive that came out of the eugenics movement. Not. One. Thing. That trope is advertised by people with not-too-secret sympathies for things like what I linked (which, by the way, never really ended). Everything good that happened in the last 100 years came from people who usually got screwed in the end, and a lot of good things that should happen and can happen won't thanks to eugenic doctrine. Today, eugenics is experiencing an ugly resurgence among young people, and the message is being drilled in schools and public media harder than any time since the 1930s.

No form of eugenics is positive, and anyone claiming so is a liar, a cheat, or worse a cowardly apologist. The only way forward is to take these stupid, ignorant snakes and do what needs to be done with them for the safety of the vast majority of people and any form of civilization worth keeping.

That article is about events that took place from the 40's to the 70's. You can go back on ANYONE or any culture or religion if you go back far enough. Post something current that shows they are still doing those things.....

I'm not going to play a game like this. Anyone who would even apologize for eugenics and deny its atrocious nature is obviously an apologist, and in regards to such people the only principle that can be followed is guilty before proven innocent - and given the obvious eugenic biases of many people here and institutional eugenics, society is still guilty as sin. Pretending eugenics doesn't exist and isn't in full force isn't just a matter of ignorance, but willful support of those atrocities.

Perhaps what truly stops eugenism from killing more people is the reality that, for population controllers, they really have no need to dispose of so many unwanted people; certainly not for lack of resources, or even difficulty to control 7 billion people. In fact, in many ways it's easier for population controllers to handle 7 billion than it is to handle 500 million, so long as a fraction of that 7 billion is clawing at those beneath them and the vast majority can never organize in any meaningful way. 500 million people who were promised a future under eugenics would have no reason to continue following the eugenic religion once its stated aims are accomplished, and would expect a higher standard of living and rights - indeed, the very nature of the eugenic ideology is one that can only lead to eternal oppression, forever, and followers of that religion will inevitably exhaust any natural resources they access. Eugenics is nothing new or especially creative - it is instead an appeal to the most base of human instincts and beliefs, and religion born out of nothing but hatred and the desire to dominate over others, its adherents generally being STUPID people whose accomplishments rest entirely on those they stepped over.

there is no hope said:

I'm not going to play a game with someone who clearly sympathizes with brutal eugenics.

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Never said I sympathize with them. I said post something current, not what happened 45-75 years ago.
Hell, white people owned slaves and treated black people horribly, does that mean we are still horrible?
Germans tortured Jews back in the world war, does that mean they are still horrible?
Get my point?

kamya said:

There are a lot of positive things that can be done with eugenics, just not the kind in that article. It's going to happen either way. The science is starting to get there.

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I'm glad I'll be dead by the time it gets into full swing, most likely. My contribution is not contributing children to that world to live through such a thing.

We'd do better to fix people's minds, hearts, and souls than their genetics.

The biggest lie is that eugenics has anything to do with fixing someone's genes, or fixing anything really. It is, always has been, and always will be, a purely destructive religion, a poison on the intellect and soul of anyone affected by it.
Eugenists try to claim credit for advances in medical technology, when in fact eugenism has done the most to retard medical technology, deny medical care, and do anything in their power to mismanage the health care system in any country they touch. That humanity progressed at all technologically or socially has been entirely in SPITE of eugenic ideas. Eugenics, as I say, is nothing new, but a regurgitation of all the most evil and disgusting beliefs humans have kept kicking around since they started writing things down; it is not just pseudo-science, but a perversion of something that sounds scientific enough to grant legitimacy in the eyes of some weak-minded people who are content to be followers (which is backed of course by the threat of brute violence and harassment, whether by state violence of paramilitary violence). Eugenics is, in fact, the END of science or civilization, in all of its forms. Its adherents should be treated as nothing more than typical violent criminals at best.

there is no hope said:

The biggest lie is that eugenics has anything to do with fixing someone's genes, or fixing anything really. It is, always has been, and always will be, a purely destructive religion, a poison on the intellect and soul of anyone affected by it.
Eugenists try to claim credit for advances in medical technology, when in fact eugenism has done the most to retard medical technology, deny medical care, and do anything in their power to mismanage the health care system in any country they touch. That humanity progressed at all technologically or socially has been entirely in SPITE of eugenic ideas. Eugenics, as I say, is nothing new, but a regurgitation of all the most evil and disgusting beliefs humans have kept kicking around since they started writing things down; it is not just pseudo-science, but a perversion of something that sounds scientific enough to grant legitimacy in the eyes of some weak-minded people who are content to be followers (which is backed of course by the threat of brute violence and harassment, whether by state violence of paramilitary violence). Eugenics is, in fact, the END of science or civilization, in all of its forms. Its adherents should be treated as nothing more than typical violent criminals at best.

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When cornered, they always resort to pithy sarcasm.
Good work, monster.

there is no hope said:

When cornered, they always resort to pithy sarcasm.
Good work, monster.

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Or sometimes they just don't see the point in arguing anymore when people don't want to look at the other side of what said people believe.
There comes a point when it's just pointless to keep trying to reason with anyone. Not saying he's right, not saying you're right, just saying.

There are no sides, only what happened and the truth.
There are beliefs which are diametrically opposed and cannot be resolved through reason, which is exactly what eugenism is. Thus, when cornered, the eugenist will always resort to petty sarcasm or other such tactics when they are sitting on unassailable power, and when they do not have power they will do what the Nazis did and run whatever state they operate into the ground.

I'd rather not see America ran like Nazi Germany was ran when the honeysuckle hit their fan, but that's what will likely happen. I won't be around to see it hopefully.

I'm still waiting to see something that horrible that happened within the last decade or so. As I said, basing an entire organization/group of people on what happened in the decades ago is not logical....

What if eugenics someday leads to the excision of the cancer-causing gene from the human genome? Or the development of immunities to any number of deadly viruses?

It's rather shortsighted to denounce an entire field of science as evil because it was misused in the past. Nazi Germany also produced the first jet plane - would you refuse to board a modern passenger plane because of that? They also developed the first ballistic missile, without which space exploration and satellite communication as we know them today would be impossible. Science is neither good or evil, it simply is. It's mankind who uses it to destroy and cause suffering.

Eugenics has cured absolutely NOTHING.

Nazis did a lot of things, sometimes in spite of their ideology. Just about anything worthwhile came from people who were looking to not be utterly crushed, while the fanatics were more interested in wrecking as much as possible, while relatively innocent people struggled to survive the mess those fanatics created. It never ceases, how often eugenist scum demand responsibility from others but absolve themselves of guilt. It goes beyond mere hypocrisy or cowardice.

Eugenics is not science, it's not even pseudo-science.
I should be surprised so many people defend it, considering that there is absolutely nothing to redeem these atrocities. Not one thing was learned, the entire exercise was one of pure sadism and cruelty (which is probably why so many people here are defending it, and using the most sick and disgusting apologism for it).
You can understand biology and genetics without the eugenist religion, in fact eugenic religion is probably the greatest barrier to medical advance, and eugenist religion has an incentive to keep those deemed unfit sick if not kill them.

Anyone with correct morals shouldn't be criticizing opposition to eugenism, they should be denouncing eugenism and criticizing only the particular crimes and the degree of those crimes that eugenism is responsible for.
Denial of eugenic crimes should be considered a crime and a statement of intent to commit further crimes.

there is no hope said:

I should be surprised so many people defend it, considering that there is absolutely nothing to redeem these atrocities. Not one thing was learned, the entire exercise was one of pure sadism and cruelty (which is probably why so many people here are defending it, and using the most sick and disgusting apologism for it).

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I'm sorry, you post a 4 year old article about something that happened 40-70 years ago and nothing else and expect the rest of us to either take your word for it or do our own research? Sorry, I'm doing neither.

PROVE that they haven't learned anything, PROVE that they are the same evil ******** as they were before.
Back your honeysuckle up, don't just post and expect people to fall in line.

I don't need proof. The very fact that something like this happens is proof enough that eugenics is a wholly evil ideology at its foundation.

I can tell you how mental institutions work, if that helps. Those were (and are) outgrowths of eugenic programs, something those who have to deal with them are well aware of. Of course, you will deny those atrocities, as you will deny any eugenic atrocities, because you are sympathetic to them and there is no way to convince you otherwise.

If I really want to, I can spend time out of my day digging up more recent stories of eugenic atrocities, because they're out in the open. The point is that no one cares and keeps denying that the eugenic ideology is an atrocity, because they are proud of what happens and will continue doing what they can. No matter how much evidence I post, YOU will always defend eugenics and apologize for the most extreme fanaticism, because that has been your character in all prior interactions, and eugenists NEVER change. I sure as hell have never seen it, not in a true way. Your entire signature is a regurgitation of that ugly religion and its principles.

Anti-eugenic laws and resistance to eugenism aren't something that come about because eugenist scum are nice or gracious enough to allow freedom - they only happen because enough people are willing to resist and exhaust the resources of eugenist scum, and eugenist scum are cowardly, stupid, and ultimately too weak to do what they want to do.

It's sad to see that so many people are failing this most obvious test. Anyone who defends eugenics deserves nothing but suffering.

there is no hope said:

Anyone who defends eugenics deserves nothing but suffering.

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The very fact that you think this way proves that you are both a zealot and moral terrorist who is no better than the evil they claim to despise.

there is no hope said:

I don't need proof. The very fact that something like this happens is proof enough that eugenics is a wholly evil ideology at its foundation.

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YOU don't need proof that's fine, the majority of the rest of the population does. You want to comment on something like this and be rude to us because we don't fall in line with you, you NEED to provide RECENT proof.

"The very fact that something like this happens" Um, how many Jews did the Nazis kill? So that's enough for ALL Germans to be evil? How many slaves have white people owned? Does that mean ALL white people are evil?
Dude, wake up....past transgressions does NOT make an organization STILL evil.

there is no hope said:

I can tell you how mental institutions work, if that helps.

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No, I don't want you to tell me honeysuckle, I want PROOF. FACT, not your opinion.

there is no hope said:

The point is that no one cares and keeps denying that the eugenic ideology is an atrocity, because they are proud of what happens and will continue doing what they can. No matter how much evidence I post, YOU will always defend eugenics and apologize for the most extreme fanaticism, because that has been your character in all prior interactions, and eugenists NEVER change. I sure as hell have never seen it, not in a true way. Your entire signature is a regurgitation of that ugly religion and its principles.

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I'm not denying anything. I make no judgments unless I have PROOF....proof which you fail to provide, which makes me think you have none.

As for my signature, how is it about religion? It's about people being themselves, owning who they are and what they are about. That doesn't have anything to do with religion, it has to do with being your own person regardless of what you've been through.

there is no hope said:

It's sad to see that so many people are failing this most obvious test. Anyone who defends eugenics deserves nothing but suffering.

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The only person I see failing here is you, by not providing RECENT PROOF that happened in the last decade. Don't fault us because you want everyone to fall in line without any proof.
I'm not defending eugenics at all here, regardless of what you think, all I want is proof before I make any judgments...it's this moral thing I got going, sorry if that offends you.
As for you deciding who should suffer, that's not on YOU to decide. NO ONE should suffer just because you think something is evil and you don't provide PROOF of your claims.