People don't like me..

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LonelySutton

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This isn't going to be one of those "people don't like me" like a plea for people to say they do. They don't. Its a fact. I know it, I have always known it. But I guess I hoped I had some people who do. But I think I have lived enough to know ... a few things.

1. People who currently like me.... are, in all likelihood in temporary like with me. I am not quite sure how this happens but I have a few people in my world who really really really like me. Eat me up... put me in awkward positions like me. But generally, I find these people fall out of like with me... if they like me now, it is just a matter of time until they don't. My guess... I am very funny and kind of have a routine of jokes and after a bit... they get tired. Also... I think a lot of what people like about me is potential. Like they think I will go drinking with them or they think I will open up to them some day and, when I don't... they lose interest.

1a. This group is the group of people who flat out, seem to use me. Oh they like me alright, as long as I listen to them go on for hours about something. They like me when I am not having a good go of things so they can feel better about themselves and gossip. They like me when they are working in my workplace for a month and have no one else to talk to. Oh, yeh, they like me. And then, they are gone. At this point I have just started using them.

2. There are a lot of people who don't like me. These include people who judge based on looks and "what things you have". I have always stubbornly hated this and go out of my way not to be fashionable and have the right things. This seems almost offensive to those who are fashionable and have the right things. As it almost is an edge they have and they resent that you won't make those things more important. At one point I did get a BMW and I got a lot of friends from these type of people and, in the end, it just bothered me. I was disgusted with their friendship while they obviously thought I should have thanked my lucky stars for their interest. IMHO, these people are sheep and seem to actively get upset with you that you won't conform. Conforming like, seems to be a way of entry into their club. And that is that. Your with them, or you are against them.

2a. There are people who just don't like me... enough. You know who these people are when you throw a party and they don't come. But they go to a mutual friend's party. Or they are always talking about your mutual friend and how awesome they are -- to you. Never are you the "Regina George" of the group. You are always their friend, if no one else is available.

The long and the short of it... running out of friends. Did I ever have any friends? Kind of an interesting question. Yeh, I had some long term friends but each and every one has faded. And, typically, it isn't like we grew apart but, more like they got to know me. But when I was younger I am not sure I was able to see things and patterns quite so clearly. Should I even try for anything better anymore? I just accept that "friends" are temporary and I need to just keep fooling people for short periods to maintain a group of friends at any given point.

** ps.. should anyone on this board assume I am talking about them, I am not, I am speaking of people in real life.
 
That's so sad. What kind of people are you looking for? Is it just friends or a potential relationship? I met a woman yesterday who has lived in her home for two years and not connected with anyone even though she is outgoing and friendly. So sad, but maybe the world has changed and people are more guarded about themselves and their privacy - especially if you are seen as a bit of an outsider. I am married but have been reclusive for a long time and would dearly like a small group of women friends who live close to me. I think that most women want some kind of friendship and support.

To get back to what you wrote in your post, I feel that you are saying that the only way you have been able to keep friends in the past is to be there for them and suppress your own needs. Then when you do become yourself, these people do not resonate well with you, because they do not feel close to you. Sometimes the only way to find out is to be yourself and to risk expressing your feelings and needs and see who responds?
 
LonesomeDay said:
That's so sad. What kind of people are you looking for? Is it just friends or a potential relationship?

LOL I didn't think it was going to be that sad. I am just looking for normal people but you know... I am starting to wonder. Is it only now, because I am at midlife that I can recognize that all friendships... male or female are temporary and perhaps, not even worth it? Is it that I am recognizing the patterns?

I am also wondering lately, I find people sort of mentally deficient and there is a lot of evidence that people are getting hammered with chemicals etc that cause them to be "less" such as lead in the water and recently I saw a study that said Tylenol is causing diminution in mental ability.

I want friends who invite me to things on the weekends. I want friends who respond to me when I text them. I want friends who like my facebook posts. That is it? But I can't find them. And if I have a few, I wonder how long it will be before they start getting sick of me. If I get stranded by a broken down train, I want ONE person I can call that will come get me.

Then when you do become yourself, these people do not resonate well with you, because they do not feel close to you.

It is at the point now where these people just leave when they are done using me. Blah blah blah... oh got to go bye.

Sometimes I wonder if it is the place I live. I have a friend in the south who always seems to have friends. True friends. I am not sure it is about her as much as the definition of friends in the south seems like they see it more as a close reciprocal relationship than in the north.
 
LonelySutton said:
This isn't going to be one of those "people don't like me" like a plea for people to say they do. They don't. Its a fact. I know it, I have always known it. But I guess I hoped I had some people who do. But I think I have lived enough to know ... a few things.

1. People who currently like me.... are, in all likelihood in temporary like with me. I am not quite sure how this happens but I have a few people in my world who really really really like me. Eat me up... put me in awkward positions like me. But generally, I find these people fall out of like with me... if they like me now, it is just a matter of time until they don't. My guess... I am very funny and kind of have a routine of jokes and after a bit... they get tired. Also... I think a lot of what people like about me is potential. Like they think I will go drinking with them or they think I will open up to them some day and, when I don't... they lose interest.

1a. This group is the group of people who flat out, seem to use me. Oh they like me alright, as long as I listen to them go on for hours about something. They like me when I am not having a good go of things so they can feel better about themselves and gossip. They like me when they are working in my workplace for a month and have no one else to talk to. Oh, yeh, they like me. And then, they are gone. At this point I have just started using them.

2. There are a lot of people who don't like me. These include people who judge based on looks and "what things you have". I have always stubbornly hated this and go out of my way not to be fashionable and have the right things. This seems almost offensive to those who are fashionable and have the right things. As it almost is an edge they have and they resent that you won't make those things more important. At one point I did get a BMW and I got a lot of friends from these type of people and, in the end, it just bothered me. I was disgusted with their friendship while they obviously thought I should have thanked my lucky stars for their interest. IMHO, these people are sheep and seem to actively get upset with you that you won't conform. Conforming like, seems to be a way of entry into their club. And that is that. Your with them, or you are against them.

2a. There are people who just don't like me... enough. You know who these people are when you throw a party and they don't come. But they go to a mutual friend's party. Or they are always talking about your mutual friend and how awesome they are -- to you. Never are you the "Regina George" of the group. You are always their friend, if no one else is available.

The long and the short of it... running out of friends. Did I ever have any friends? Kind of an interesting question. Yeh, I had some long term friends but each and every one has faded. And, typically, it isn't like we grew apart but, more like they got to know me. But when I was younger I am not sure I was able to see things and patterns quite so clearly. Should I even try for anything better anymore? I just accept that "friends" are temporary and I need to just keep fooling people for short periods to maintain a group of friends at any given point.

** ps.. should anyone on this board assume I am talking about them, I am not, I am speaking of people in real life.

I like you. Very much actually. Even when Im emotionally destroyed and lifeless, I still like you. You might be the only person I do like. Anyway, people dont like me either... Whatever, They can screw themselves. I said it before, if you were a man I would marry you. Unfortunatly however, 2 straight woman make for a bad marriage lol, Point being... I wish i could make multiple clones of both of us to run the world lol.
 
stork_error said:
I like you. Very much actually. Even when Im emotionally destroyed and lifeless, I still like you. You might be the only person I do like. Anyway, people dont like me either... Whatever, They can screw themselves. I said it before, if you were a man I would marry you. Unfortunatly however, 2 straight woman make for a bad marriage lol, Point being... I wish i could make multiple clones of both of us to run the world lol.

Err.. thank you but I do want to refrain from "you like me you really like me." I know I am awesome but I do think that not a lot of other people do and at a certain point I am wondering if I can do anything to change it or will I have to kind of become a person I HATE to do so and then, what then?

I think people don't like me because:
(1) I am crazy independent. I mean most people in this world can be influenced with peer pressure. Not me. At all. This leads to a certain level of inflexibility that they don't like. I feel like my inflexibility is only about LARGE issues but I feel a lot of people have grown to expect that you will just do what they want on those issues. For example.. one time I went to a xmas party with a co worker and friend from work. She told me at the start of the night that she was going to get drunk and she would crash on my couch. Um... huh? I stopped and did my "HOLD THE PHONE" face and said, no you won't. She laughed, I said, no, you can't get drunk and sleep on my couch. She laughed... I no longer trusted that she wouldn't ignore me so I left. We are still friends but, not as much. I know she was flat out stunned at my reaction and thought I was weird.

(2) I refuse to "perform" for them. Each weekend I do nothing... even if I did something it would be none of their business. So every Monday, they ask, what did you do this weekend. And every Monday I say nothing. This frustrates them and annoys them. Personally I don't think they should ask. I don't ask. It isn't that I don't care but I don't ask. If they did something fun that they want to share with me... they are free to. But in other words... I am boring. I remember how popular I was when I was buying my house. Everyone wanted to talk to me. I feel like I made some bad choices there FOR THEM. Now that I have problems ... not like they are interested.

(3) I do think there are a substantial group that is upwardly mobile and can't really respect or be around those who aren't just like them. If you have a BMW, they want to talk to you... if you don't... well... I mean perhaps I am being too hard on them. Perhaps these things are the only things they have to talk about so, if you don't have them or are interested in them, they have nothing to talk to you about. But the fact that I ditched the BMW for a Toyota Yaris, makes them infuriated because they have nothing to talk about with them and says you are not like them at all. You don't care what people think about you and you don't need "things" to be happy and I suspect, they are a little jealous of you.

(4) I am not gifty. Now certainly I get the check at a reasonably normal period of time but have you ever had one of those friends who picks you up like a useless gift just to show you how much they like you? Who does that? I don't need a pen or a perfume gift. You don't have to buy my friendship? But other people do this to me and somehow expect me to reciprocate. I know, it is crazy. Or, if you are going to take me out for lunch, if I say thank you.. do not expect a written card!

(5) I don't go to things that I get invited to. Well this is tricky... because I do sometimes... but I don't most of the time.

(6) I do feel some people get annoyed with me because I don't date. This includes my brother. But I refuse to do anything in this area because of their peer pressure (see the house situation) and something I have always thought was odd, they get angry at me for not trying here but also, NEVER LIFT A FINGER to introduce me to anyone? I still have a friend who literally offered to buy me an outfit before a date (which I thought was offensive anyway) but she had two son's my age and never would like even say their names out-loud as if then I wouldn't know they existed.

I guess it is like that Doors song... people are strange when your a stranger. I think maybe I do need to change at least some of these things. Perhaps I could make things up to interest people. Or make efforts to leave my office during the day and visit people or throw parties or some such. But you think, will that get you anything or just temporary friends.
 
If I'm being honest then yes, many of those things would make you a very difficult person to be friends with or be with romantically. But you acknowledge that you refuse to change any of this so
I don't really have much to offer. Wait and hope.

It doesn't really seem like you even want friends.

As long as you love yourself and have no problem with how you are. That's probably worth more than changing who you are. I just hope you can find someone. It will be difficult I wont lie.
 
It's much easier (in real life) to make friends than to maintain friendships, in my opinion. People change, circumstances change and occasionally people - including me - just don't want to put the effort needed into keeping a friendship. I've made the mistake of thinking co-workers were friends and then it turned out when one or the other of us left the job we had nothing else in common, so the friendship fizzled out. But that's life.

May I ask a question, Lonely Sutton? Do you like people? I'm asking because I sometimes get into a "people suck" funk and it sort of becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. So if that's where you're at, I feel ya. The good news is, it doesn't have to be that way.

Edit to add: You asked in your OP "Should I even try for anything better anymore? " Well, yes, of course you should. I think you sound depressed - which can greatly inhibit and impinge on our ability to be social and to make friends. You seem very methodical and logic-oriented. I have a book on my bookshelf called "Feeling Good" by David M. Burns, M.D. and it's helped me a lot. Whatever happens, I hope you're able to find some contentment.

-Teresa
 
LonelySutton said:
LonesomeDay said:
That's so sad. What kind of people are you looking for? Is it just friends or a potential relationship?

... I want friends who invite me to things on the weekends. I want friends who respond to me when I text them. I want friends who like my facebook posts. ...

I feel that you need a friendship with someone who is genuinely interested in you as a person: someone who wants to take the time to get to know you better.

I'm not sure if an online friendship would meet all of your needs, but it can probably meet some of them.

However, these days, I'm aware that the internet is full of risks, and personally, I'm not as trusting as I used to be.

There seems to be a lot of 'penpal' sites around though, if you're willing to take the risk of talking to strangers.
 
You sound like me in your initial post. I have been wondering too if there is such a thing as a friend for life. People keep walking in and out and it gets lonely seeing people connecting with each other and being the one left behind.

I don't have any advice, but it's hard. You sound like you're handling much better though. It is great that you're so independent. I hope you meet some great people soon.
 
I'm sure there must be at least few people out there who will like you, maybe you just haven't met them yet.

I wish I could give more advises since I feel the same kind of often... :/

Best of luck to you!
 
LonelySutton said:
LOL I didn't think it was going to be that sad. I am just looking for normal people but you know... I am starting to wonder. Is it only now, because I am at midlife that I can recognize that all friendships... male or female are temporary and perhaps, not even worth it? Is it that I am recognizing the patterns?

Well, in my experience and observation they're either temporary or based in fantasy or psychosis. People drift apart, either physically or due to changed circumstances. I find I don't break up with them in some sort of fight, but the gravity that made the friendship no longer exists. It's often lovely encountering them later, but the friendship doesn't pick up where it left off...ever. We're just in different places.

As for whether the friendships are worth it...yeah, they are. Friends are people you allow close enough to you to let them see you, and they've shown that they're worthy of that confidence by accepting you as you are. The distance between me and them varies, one by one, but it's worth it to find people who both care about me and will be honest with me...at least when I ask for it. But that, too, passes; the friends at work will drift away when one of us doesn't work there any more. It just happens.

LonelySutton said:
I want friends who invite me to things on the weekends. I want friends who respond to me when I text them. I want friends who like my facebook posts. That is it? But I can't find them. And if I have a few, I wonder how long it will be before they start getting sick of me. If I get stranded by a broken down train, I want ONE person I can call that will come get me.

Do you invite them first? Do they accept your invitation but then don't reciprocate? OK, that's valuable information and let 'em go. Goes double for people who don't respond to your texts; don't respond twice, and they're history. I was a little surprised to read that you wanted friends who would like your facebook posts, but then I don't like anyone's facebook posts. It's too much work to sift through the 99.84% of insipid FB posts to look for something worthwhile. Maybe your tribe isn't on FB; maybe they're in a subreddit filled with smart, snarky, truly interesting people. Or maybe they need you to start the community. (disclosure- I've never found my tribe and goodness knows, I've looked, and even tried to create it once or twice).


LonelySutton said:
It is at the point now where these people just leave when they are done using me. Blah blah blah... oh got to go bye.

good riddance to bad rubbish then. I think you set a high bar for being your friend, which is your right...

LonelySutton said:
Sometimes I wonder if it is the place I live. I have a friend in the south who always seems to have friends. True friends. I am not sure it is about her as much as the definition of friends in the south seems like they see it more as a close reciprocal relationship than in the north.

There probably are more guarded, closed, hyper-competitive people in the north than in the south, esp. in somewhere like NYC, DC, and Boston. I'm from Texas and found on moving to mid-Missouri that a lot more people here weren't outgoing at all like I was used to...and I was always the shy one in Texas. And the guardedness only ramps up as I've traveled north...more guarded in Iowa than missouri, more so in Minnesota and Wisconsin than Iowa, and so on.

I believe you're a smart, somewhat prickly person, and I think you prefer being that way. (takes one to know one) You have every right to be your true self, but you'll probably always be something of a minority taste in friends. That's ok, but acknowledge that you'll have to work harder to find the right people for your life.

But here's the good news from about 15-18 years in your future (and my present)-- eventually, you'll have a lot more in common with people that you don't share as much with now. All of you will hurt in various parts of your body. You'll all get fat(ter). You'll all have experienced loss, age discrimination at work and elsewhere, and in general a sort of invisibility that age confers on us. You'll have something to talk about with both socialites and former ditch diggers. One of the best times I had in recent years was attending a pre-retirement seminar that was exactly as I described; truck drivers, psychiatrists, secretaries, even another lawyer. We compared notes, laughed at the more than faint ridiculousness of aging, exchanged tips on prescription drugs that worked and didn't, and we all agreed we laughed more than we had in months, at least.

I hope I haven't offended or insulted you (too much).
 
cyrano said:
I hope I haven't offended or insulted you (too much).

No, very good post.

but the friendship doesn't pick up where it left off...ever. We're just in different places.

I agree, but how did I get to a place where I don't make new friends. In my younger years this cycle went on but each year I would make new friends and have a few potentials around me.. now... zip. I suspect that it does have to do with the trap that I work and have for 10 years in the same job. So I am sort of trapped without ability to make friends but, I even find it hard to make new friends in the "things" I do outside of work.

Do you invite them first? Do they accept your invitation but then don't reciprocate? OK, that's valuable information and let 'em go. Goes double for people who don't respond to your texts; don't respond twice, and they're history. I was a little surprised to read that you wanted friends who would like your facebook posts, but then I don't like anyone's facebook posts.

I don't know... I feel like I do enough.. to the extent I don't it is because I know they might not be able to come. Like some of them have kids and have to be home on the vacation week. But I definatley pay for meals and get meals for people and do things to be helpful. Re facebook, see what I have come to? I just want you to hit "like" I like seeing those notifications. On this I definitely like everything I can.

good riddance to bad rubbish then. I think you set a high bar for being your friend, which is your right...

HA, as if I could get rid of them. They are right back the second they want to use me again. I have just started using them for my purposes. Why? Because I don't have real friends to use for those needs. I find these users to take far far far more from me than I do them.

And the guardedness only ramps up as I've traveled north...more guarded in Iowa than missouri, more so in Minnesota and Wisconsin than Iowa, and so on.

Yup... in the north. I lived in Michigan for a while and was kind of a snob. I just didn't know how to act. It is weird though. When I came to live in my current development (in the North) everyone waived at me. I thought oh boy maybe this place will be a friendly nice place. But it isn't. I was the flavor of the month. The trustees ran up to me to encourage me to get on the board. they seemed genuinely interested in me. I got on the board, they used me to remove a few other board members... and... bam. I was persona non Grata. Weirdly now I get the worst of all worlds... I have to faux waive at my neighbors but, we never talk, and if we do, it is torture.

One of the best times I had in recent years was attending a pre-retirement seminar that was exactly as I described; truck drivers, psychiatrists, secretaries, even another lawyer. We compared notes, laughed at the more than faint ridiculousness of aging, exchanged tips on prescription drugs that worked and didn't, and we all agreed we laughed more than we had in months, at least.

So you a lawyer too? I hope. It has occurred to me that I am at an awkward age. In the mid forties most people my age have kids and are dealing with that. So the people who don't aren't my age and simply have different interests. So as I age I will catch up to those who are both my age and situation. Also, obviously when I retire I will be able to pursue friends more easily. But right now it is really horrible.
 
three thoughts because it's late and, like a lot of lawyers you may know, I brought work home that I need to file Monday morning--

1. I subscribe to Seth Godin's daily web postings. Earlier this week he wrote about problems and paradoxes; a problem can be difficult but has a solution; by definition, a paradox doesn't. Here it is:

http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog/2016/04/turning-paradoxes-into-problems.html

He says it better than I could summarize it. I wonder if you've outsmarted yourself (something I have done many times) and created a paradox, made worse by the genuine pain you feel.

2. WRT being at a suboptimal age for making friends and things might improve in the future, you're right in a sense, but the world's filled with lonely old people too. Once we're out of school and the premarital years after college, it's much harder making friends.

3. I wonder if this is at some level a crisis of spirit. You know, at a deep level, that your value as a person doesn't depend on how many friends you have (never mind, dear Zeus, how many FB friends); what matters is...are you reliable? honest? considerate? compassionate? And something else, something that your pain indicates a negative answer to-- are you comfortable with yourself? That should be one of the greatest gifts of age, that you accept yourself, real and virtual warts and all.

4. ok, four thoughts--in the eating alone thread, you wished for an app that would hook people up just to eat with each other. It's not exactly the same thing, but four years ago I started a meetup group in my mid-Missouri university town of about 100,000, organizing shared meals at places i thought sounded interesting to go try-- a time-warp drive-in that makes its own root beer, a Mexican food place where no one speaks English, the two Chinese places that serve the Chinese student/faculty market (no General Tso's chicken there), a folkie/hillbilly place on the river where live-on-the-land hippies and college students listen to folk music, eat mediocre Thai food cooked in a trailer, and sometimes get high together. My motivation was, I wanted to try these places and my wife was tired of being dragged along with me. At its height, we had over 350 members, although it was a core group of 20-30 people who came most of the time. Anyway, I'd still do it, only it eventually wore me out socially-- that, and I made the mistake of not requiring people to pay dues to stay in the group, so I disbanded it when meetup.com wanted too much money from me to keep it going. But I keep thinking about something else in that line...for some reason, "the Mid-Missouri Tequila and Debating Society" keeps surfacing. My point (at long last) being, try something different. meetup.com probably won't hit you up for money for several months at first, and you can always just disband it if it's not working for you. The definition of failure is to keep doing the same thing and wonder why it's not working.
 
I think cyrano has said most of anything that needed said. That said, I do have things to say.

I thought the OP was not as sad as it was harsh. But, yeah, I get it. I suffer cyrano's Gravity Dissipation; that slow dissolve of interests between friends. I think getting older makes us resolute in our ideals, and our propensity toward others ideals loses a certain necessity.

When we are young we are exploring. We give leeway to those around us because we aren't really going anywhere, so we can follow along for a bit. Friendships seem to develop easily. After decades upon decades of experiences we have forged our path and, unless someone is following the same path, paths only intersect but don't often run parallel. We stagnate in our jobs and our activities so opportunities to meet different people are limited.

Those friends we leave by the wayside, interests change, leaving a gap where there was none. We might still shake hands if we meet on the street, or hug or kiss cheeks, but the shared activities don't offer the rewards to both parties and time makes them few. A life long friend isn't impossible, but I think it would have to be someone of like mind that changes as you do.

When we try to design our appeal to others we aren't showing ourselves. That can only result in being a stranger to our new friends. Friendships are built on a compatibility that can't be if you keep yourself a secret.

I don't care for a BMW, or the virtual high hat that accompanies it. Give me an old Ford or Chevy and I'm happy. I don't even mind a dent or two. The idea of a car is only to get from point A to point B, and if someones concern is how they look going between points then we are already at a distance. I don't care about your rung on the social latter, but if you care about your rung too much then there is little for me to like.

Appearance isn't the basis of a relationship. If you can't suffer nose or ear hair then it is you that has the issue (read that here). Those sorts of things are petty perturbations that deny the opportunity to know who someone is. I use appearance only as in the fashion sense, things people can change. However, we are each programmed with an appreciation of shape. The way certain geometries come together can affect our predilections. I don't like that car, I don't like that house, I don't like that face. Some call that taste, but it is only taste when it is compared to another's predilection. And therein, good taste or bad taste is subjective.

Our disposition for shape is complex, relating to our experiences good and bad. Sometimes perfectly good people don't appeal to our appreciation of shape and for that they are repelled. It isn't personal, or intentional. In the same token, very bad people can appeal to our discernment and drag us into pure trouble.

We can either forgive or condemn based on this inherent discretion, and what might have been a wonderful relationship, but for their shape, never gets the chance.

On the other hand, if you accept your friends based on their wardrobe or their ability to buy things then you have no room to complain when you get shelved...or stabbed in the back.

If you want a long term friend then you have to be yourself. You have to frequent activities that you enjoy. Who you are has to be visible. This isn't advice. It is simply logical.

It is my lack of friends that has left me to ponder these points of friendship. Just because one understands the foundation of friendship doesn't mean they have been able to meet such people. I have discovered geography is an important aspect in gaining friends. People are so different when you get out of your environment. Finding anyone to share your ideals is a long shot. Having similar interests has little adhesion when our belief systems vary greatly.

Another apt aspect of friends, since everyone here has used the word in plural, is the difficulty in finding friends that can be friends. The older we get the harder that becomes, simply because we become cemented in our ideals with only a minimum of flexibility. Finding acceptance across the board in a group is unlikely. That doesn't mean there can't be a group of friends, just that the closeness of that group is dependent on compatible attitudes.

Just my pinion.

JC
 
Menorahman said:
TC sounds like an insecure narcissist who gets off on people disliking her.

So easy to say honeysuckle when one is behind a screen.

We can all pretend we are above enjoying getting likes on facebook but It takes a person who's keenly aware of their own psychology, and is in tune with his or her own ego needs to actually admit it and face it.

It sounds narcissistic at face value but look a little deeper, and you will find a common human need to be acknowledged and heard, and not a narcissistic need for admiration and ego stroking.

Trust me when I tell you, LS is keenly aware of reality, about the world and about herself.
 

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