Does the powerlessness of it bother you sometimes?

I've been feeling that way lately. Like I can put in all the effort I want finding places to hang out, improving my conversational skills, etc, but I can just as easily wind up with nothing as something (and I wind up with a whole lot more nothing).

If you don't try enough, then that's to blame. If you try too hard, that's also to blame.

It's so frustrating. Like I'm just supposed to sit here and wait for things to change at some unforeseen point in the future due to some outside force.

I feel that way all the time, and have for years. Anything I've put effort into or hoped for in the past 6 or so years has fallen apart despite my best efforts, so I figure it's best not to even try. Hard work doesn't guarantee results, it just improves your chances of a lucky break.

Sports players like to say stuff like "you miss every shot you don't take," but that's not true. Not even taking a shot means you can't miss. I'd rather not take the shot at all than try and fail, being left with nothing but the admonition and criticisms of everyone who saw me try and fail.

Yup. I have a good situation when it comes to my friendships but I've given up on romance for the most part. I've wasted too much time and energy with nothing to show for it. At this point I can say that I'm pretty jaded and I believe it definitely shows. Combine that with me realizing that after such a long dry spell, I don't really want to sacrifice much of my independence for a relationship anymore, and that's where I am. =P

Focusing on health/money instead has been much more rewarding when it comes to getting results and quality of life improvements.

Sometimes I feel like giving up might be better for my sanity.

I do put in a lot of effort initiating conversations, looking for things that interest me, taking care of health and hobbies, etc, but what else am I supposed to do? That can just as easily mean pleasant conversations about superficial topics with coworkers as real conversations with friends.

Again, if I try too hard, that's a negative. If I stop trying, that's also a negative. And yet nothing is really happening, and has not been happening for a long time.

I have about 3-4 what you might call real friends, but at my age a lot of people seem satisfied with polite surface level conversation. I like to talk more openly but have to consciously reign it in now, which is frustrating. I guess something is better than nothing.

Perhaps you should stop trying so hard (which is not to say stop trying at all) and just be receptive to the possibility of change.
Also if you don't set a clear goal to your actions (which would otherwise be demotivating should you fail) it might be easier to find something positive to take from you efforts after the fact.

I took up hiking last year via a meetup group in an attempt to meet people (and in a way I did, in that I don't feel apprehensive being around other people, though I can't say I've made any close friends). Instead I find that now I have a new hobby that adds some exercise to my life which is something to feel good about even though I haven't had a major breakthrough in interacting with people socially.

Wintermute said:

Perhaps you should stop trying so hard (which is not to say stop trying at all) and just be receptive to the possibility of change.
Also if you don't set a clear goal to your actions (which would otherwise be demotivating should you fail) it might be easier to find something positive to take from you efforts after the fact.

I took up hiking last year via a meetup group in an attempt to meet people (and in a way I did, in that I don't feel apprehensive being around other people, though I can't say I've made any close friends). Instead I find that now I have a new hobby that adds some exercise to my life which is something to feel good about even though I haven't had a major breakthrough in interacting with people socially.

Click to expand...

I have several hobbies and social outlets already.

Wintermute said:

Perhaps you should stop trying so hard (which is not to say stop trying at all) and just be receptive to the possibility of change.
Also if you don't set a clear goal to your actions (which would otherwise be demotivating should you fail) it might be easier to find something positive to take from you efforts after the fact.

I took up hiking last year via a meetup group in an attempt to meet people (and in a way I did, in that I don't feel apprehensive being around other people, though I can't say I've made any close friends). Instead I find that now I have a new hobby that adds some exercise to my life which is something to feel good about even though I haven't had a major breakthrough in interacting with people socially.

Click to expand...

Good comments Wintermute.  You put it pretty clearly what I've been trying to think since I read the OP last night.

Tealeaf said:

Wintermute said:

Perhaps you should stop trying so hard (which is not to say stop trying at all) and just be receptive to the possibility of change.
Also if you don't set a clear goal to your actions (which would otherwise be demotivating should you fail) it might be easier to find something positive to take from you efforts after the fact.

I took up hiking last year via a meetup group in an attempt to meet people (and in a way I did, in that I don't feel apprehensive being around other people, though I can't say I've made any close friends). Instead I find that now I have a new hobby that adds some exercise to my life which is something to feel good about even though I haven't had a major breakthrough in interacting with people socially.

Click to expand...

I have several hobbies and social outlets already.

Click to expand...

I spent the entire weekend by myself. Didn't do anything, basically played videogames all day. Besides two 1 hour cessions of exercise every morning and one visit to the grocery store. Spoke with my mother in the morning and at night, talked about everything and nothing.
Then I called my oldest daughter, had a very long philosophical talk on something I'd seen (we like to do that lol. Events have also caused us to become quite close, enough that we feel comfortable talking about what's not).

...that doesn't seem like much social interaction. For me, it's enough. Hell, sometimes, it's too much.
And I'm fine with that.
You have to determine exactly what you want and at what level you want it, before proceding to change things in that direction. Sure, you want change, that's all well and good, but you need as specific goal to achieve or else, like you're feeling right now, you'll feel it was all for nothing.

Now, as you stated, "Like I can put in all the effort I want finding places to hang out, improving my conversational skills, etc, but I can just as easily wind up with nothing as something (and I wind up with a whole lot more nothing)."
Good.

What is your end goal? What would you consider as "something"? A number of X amount of friends? What is it you picture in your mind as an acceptable situation that would not lead you to reflect as to it being nothing?

Richard_39 said:

Tealeaf said:

Wintermute said:

Perhaps you should stop trying so hard (which is not to say stop trying at all) and just be receptive to the possibility of change.
Also if you don't set a clear goal to your actions (which would otherwise be demotivating should you fail) it might be easier to find something positive to take from you efforts after the fact.

I took up hiking last year via a meetup group in an attempt to meet people (and in a way I did, in that I don't feel apprehensive being around other people, though I can't say I've made any close friends). Instead I find that now I have a new hobby that adds some exercise to my life which is something to feel good about even though I haven't had a major breakthrough in interacting with people socially.

Click to expand...

I have several hobbies and social outlets already.

Click to expand...

I spent the entire weekend by myself. Didn't do anything, basically played videogames all day. Besides two 1 hour cessions of exercise every morning and one visit to the grocery store. Spoke with my mother in the morning and at night, talked about everything and nothing.
Then I called my oldest daughter, had a very long philosophical talk on something I'd seen (we like to do that lol. Events have also caused us to become quite close, enough that we feel comfortable talking about what's not).

...that doesn't seem like much social interaction. For me, it's enough. Hell, sometimes, it's too much.
And I'm fine with that.
You have to determine exactly what you want and at what level you want it, before proceding to change things in that direction. Sure, you want change, that's all well and good, but you need as specific goal to achieve or else, like you're feeling right now, you'll feel it was all for nothing.

Now, as you stated, "Like I can put in all the effort I want finding places to hang out, improving my conversational skills, etc, but I can just as easily wind up with nothing as something (and I wind up with a whole lot more nothing)."
Good.

What is your end goal? What would you consider as "something"? A number of X amount of friends? What is it you picture in your mind as an acceptable situation that would not lead you to reflect as to it being nothing?

Click to expand...

I have specific goals, too: A small number (at least one or two) of local friendships I can talk to outside of work or the hobby event we met at.

Yes, I do take initiative (and specific action) to make this happen.

Tealeaf said:

I have specific goals, too: A small number (at least one or two) of local friendships I can talk to outside of work or the hobby event we met at.

Yes, I do take initiative (and specific action) to make this happen.

Click to expand...

Good. Then you know that's not "nothing". You're taking action. While I agree with you it's frustrating, in the sense it can take a long time, I don't see any way to avoid the necessary lenght until you find someone you're compatible with on the basis of a prolonged and deep friendship. I know, it sucks, but you're being proactive, you're being logical and determine. Now you need to be patient. And it sucks lol. But that's the only thing you have to do.
When I feel like you do, that things are hard or meaningless, I usually do something unexpected to lift my spirits. Might be something as dumb as taking a job at my local park, or going for a beer (or several) at the local bar. Something to get my mind off the drearyness of existence.
But besides that, you,re on the right tack, my friend.
I get bothered by it as well, but not by the "powerlessness". I, just as you, are not powerless. We're proactive; we're exercising that power over a situation that is difficult, or long, to change.

I lately seem to think it is not about the effort you put in, it is not about hobbies, or social skills or any off that, instead it's about finding someone who is on your level to "grow" together... Sounds weird I know, but I've experienced that people who have been very social in life, even extrovert find anything less than the weird, or lacking. And people with normal social skills do the same, so for the introverted there is a very small portion left that they can "click" with easily.

I might be overthinking this, but to answer your question, yes the powerlessness does bother me at times, although it's mostly the lacking results of finding people on my level that I can "click" with and NOT have to work at like crazy to maintain even superficial relationships.

What would make you feel better Tealeaf?

The people are not worth the effort anyway.

I think I can relate to you on this. I try and try only for nothing to happen. Then all of a sudden something comes from nowhere.
I've been trying to practice and catch my patience. If I ever catch it i'm going to wring its frigging neck.
I've been trying to concentrate my energy on myself to find where my happiness is. I'm use to thinking it for others and it often feels like an almost overwhelming force against me.
But I will continue to try. I need to try.

Honestly, for me, the powerlessness is a little freeing.

I feel you're only powerless if you believe you are.

I've proven myself wrong way too many times to accept it's anything other than mindset.

Kind of...
The question I often have to ask myself about loneliness is:

Would I rather be alone, and in NO company, or have "friends" and ONLY bad company...?

I can handle solitude, I'm an INFJ with some INTJ traits, so to a certain degree it doesn't bother me.
But fresia do I hate ********! LOL

That's probably just the old bitter man in me coming out a bit. I'm kind of a hardass, not really because I want to be but because I come from a pretty rough background and life pretty much demands that I be...but I am actually quite empathic. An artist friend of mine once called me "methodically organized chaos." Speaking of art, I happen to really like Horror Vacui art (fear of empty spaces on a canvas) and Abstract Art because Abstract Art is very improvisational and therapeutic to the artist, much in the way that I approach being an improvisational musician despite the fact that I'm classically trained.

To quote the best painter I know in person, who's this lovely elderly woman that I work with: "I hate painting still life. I did it for years and now I find it boring." Hahaha.

I kind of keep people at an arm's distance.
I'm empathic, but also very, very guarded...

I'm the guy that keeps himself surrounded by a circle of outward-pointing blades so nobody can get too close to me, but I keep one, just one, inward for myself for just in case as a precaution.

There was indeed a time where I felt totally powerless in my solitude but, after some time experimenting with trying to be more social I discovered I have a hard time connecting to a society of simple, shallow, superficiality, which is the exact opposite of everything I want to be close to anyhow.

So now I'm at this weird point in my life where:
Solitude doesn't really scare me as much anymore, insanity and the infinity of thoughts doesn't really scare me anymore...but the blissfully ignorant and utterly clueless often found in youth culture have me absolutely petrified.

I don't really pay attention to pop culture phenomena, I'm aloof in my own crazy world of thoughts and ideas. So I actually have no basis of relatable conversational value to many people my own age that spend all of their money socializing for a superficial connection that they haven't realized yet isn't actually real. To some degree it actually reminds me of a Japanese horror movie called Suicide Club, in which the opening scene 48+ school girls happily hold hands as they jump in front of an on-coming subway. (Nobody watch that movie, it's actually pretty psychologically disturbing, even for me). But that's honestly kind of how it seems.

And I can't really connect with the older generation of people either, because I have no motivation to connect to my own generation, which is how their generation came to be as they currently are and so on. The Industrial Revolution, the Boomers thereafter, Gen X had to create Consultant jobs in order to employ themselves, and my generation seems to think that getting hearts and likes on social media websites qualifies as a business endeavor...because occasionally someone gives them a little bit of money for social acceptance, which I have absolutely no interest in trying to do whatsoever.

So I kind of fit...nowhere, socially.
Which is why I'm here. lol.