The truth about us undesirables

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ITellYouHhwut

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You listen to most people give advice to undesirables like myself on how to attract women, it’s very funny to see the empty, meaningless platitudes they’ll give you. They always say these very vague, nonsense things like “improve yourself” (whatever the f*** that means), or they’ll say things like “you’ve gotta show confidence” or whatever. You can never get them to admit that it’s simply because you’re an ugly undesirable with inferior genetics, women are walking genetics detectors, and that it’s simply impossible for you to achieve success with women. It’s also funny how people seem to believe that putting on different clothes or getting a haircut or tan will somehow drastically change your appearance so that you’ll be attractive to women. There is a conclusion nobody wants to seem to draw, and that’s the conclusion that people like myself are inferior, women can never want us, and the fact that we’re well into adulthood and have never had even the first experience with women is basically nature telling us that it wants us dead. Carry it to its logical conclusion, and that’s precisely what it means. It’s funny how nobody wants to admit the truth of things. They’ll find every euphemism, and every way of reinterpreting something so as to avoid admitting the harsh truth. I think we need to do a whole lot less encouraging for people like myself “improve ourselves”, and a lot more encouraging for us to self-euthanize. People like myself belong in the landfill. I don’t even deserve to be remembered.
 
People don't know you well enough on the internet to give you specific advice, so they have to tell you something vague. They think you know exactly how you can improve yourself, but if you don't know what to do, this isn't helpful at all.

Besides that, what could you do instead? You can't change women, you can only change yourself. You also could give up entirely on romantic relationships and do something else instead.

If you are really ugly and undesirable, then there should also be ugly and undesirable women too. Either they are extremely rare, or you don't want them because they are ugly and undesirable.

That you can't really change your looks is true, and it's something you can only change a bit. But it doesn't mean, that there are only beautiful women, who don't want someone ugly.

You also sound very pessimistic. If you don't have enough hope to try, then you can't succeed. I'm not saying, just be optimistic and try and everything will be alright. That's like saying to a depressed person to just be happy. Things are way more complicated and harder to change. I don't think one post from a stranger on the internet will make you motivated, and I don't even know if this is your issue, I can only guess. You probably tried a lot, and it didn't work, so you don't think it will ever work. And what do I know? I'm clearly not an expert for romantic relationships.

So yeah, I don't really know how to help you, and you neither, because if you know what to do, you will do it.
 
I think prostitution should be legalized. It's legal in Vegas, in the U.S., I think. One can't buy love, though; one can only (hopefully) give and receive it freely.

Life is not fair. That's a truth and it's one of the easier ones to discover. I'm not saying that I don't blow huge amounts of wasted air out of my mouth in vain, from time to time, forgetting that fact; but, it's not fair.

It's as if the very thing you desire: the comfort of the feminine, is also that which causes you pain, in it's absence or perceived rejection by.

I can relate to being completely hopeless and having given up almost entirely. I wouldn't know what to tell you, if that's the case; I don't know what to do myself.

Love is the symphony of the spectrum of colors. There is passionate love. There is unconditional love. There is nurturing love. There is tough love. There are all kinds of love. Perhaps you could seek out the shapes and forms of love that are available to you, or more immediate, rather than be blinded by the light of the love that seems impossible to reach?

Sometimes the medicine we need for the ailment we have, just isn't there. Some times we need a shoulder to cry on. Some times we need a spark of love to make life worth living. Some times we need a cure for cancer, cause we aren't ready to die. Every, single, day, people die. Every, single, day, people suffer; some of them needlessly through ignorance. Horrible violent and malicious atrocities happen to people individually and collectively, every, single day. Young lives are cut short. Promising lives, are ended.

...but, in all the horror and unfairness of this world, there is beauty. The flowers continue to bloom. Bees flutter about. The stars in the heavens above illuminate the night sky. Gorgeous music is being created every day. There is art. Children are laughing and playing. Good people are doing good things, every day.

See if you can't pull your gaze away from the blinding light you can't reach, and seek out some other colors on the spectrum of love?

A woman desires qualities in a man that are generally conducive to procreation and the rearing of young. Likewise, a man desires qualities in a woman also conducive to healthy, viable, offspring. I doubt so much either half of the species is any guiltier than the other, in that general sense.

I doubt very much a forum post will solve your problem. It would be nice, if things were that simple. Even if some one laid out for me, exactly what I need to to do, to fix my stuff, I probably wouldn't have the energy to go about it.

Anyway, I hope you find some beauty; since, you seem to feel lacking in it.

Perhaps one day, you WILL sell propane and propane accessories.
 
A prime example as to why I no longer try happened last night...

My friend invited me to his house for a small bonfire in his backyard with some friends, so I went.

There was this girl there who was an old friend of his. She’s single (just to add that in there). Well, my friend’s wife went to bed, leaving just my friend, his other male friend, this girl, and me. Now, I wasn’t particularly interested in this girl, I thought that this would be a good opportunity for me to try to be sociable and to let loose and give myself a chance with a woman.

I might as well had gone home, hooked up the post hole digger to my tractor, dug a hole, and buried my head in it. I tried my best to mingle and be part of the conversation, but it was quickly obvious that this girl was all over the two other guys, and absolutely wanted me to go off and die somewhere. It was obvious that I was being choked out of the conversation. I wasn’t acting overbearing or obnoxious. I was trying to be light-hearted, mildly jokey, and down for a laugh. The girl obviously hated my guts, but for the other two guys, it was effortless for them. They could just kind of sit there and say/do whatever and she would melt all over them. Which goes to show you that the advice people always give you about “acting confident” and “just putting yourself out there” works perfectly well.....if you’re the right person. All that stuff works good, but you have to be a desirable person first, THEN that stuff will work and will come into play. So it’s not that the common platitude advice is wrong, it’s just that it is irrelevant to guys like me. If you’re not judged as desirable in that 0.000005 seconds that a girl first sees you, then the rest of that advice isn’t going to matter one way or the other. Won’t make a bit of difference.

I’ve tried all the stuff people have told me. I’ve tried dressing nice, getting a good hair cut, working out (even hired a personal trainer at one point), etc. etc... Nothing. Never even the first hint of interest from women. Hell, I’m productive and hard working. My income this year is projected to reach the high six figures, or possibly even the low seven figures. Doesn’t seem to matter.

I legitimately tried last night, as I have so many times, but biology proves supreme again. The other two guys received the girl’s adulation with the most minimal of effort, meanwhile nothing I said seemed to really make a ****. I tried jokes and lighthearted conversation. Didn’t make a ****. 

I’ll never try again.
 
So they were old friends? All three of them or just the two?
 
ITellYouHhwut said:
kaetic said:
How many people came to this bonfire?

3 guests including me, then it was my friend and his wife. So 5 people total.

Is it possible that your friend and his wife were trying to hook those two up?
 
Ok, nevermind about that part.

Let's switch this up to the part about you not actually being interested in this girl. So why does it matter if she's not into you either? Is it because you decided to give it a shot and it didn't work out like you wanted? Don't get me wrong, if you want to stop trying to date that is your choice. I'm not trying to talk you out of it. I've just seen your posts before, you are very quick to beat yourself up over every perceived failure. You clearly have low self esteem, and I don't mean that as an insult. Just a direction of where to try to improve. I have no idea if working on your self esteem will lead to a date or not, but getting rid of that chip on your shoulder can't hurt your chances.
 
kaetic said:
Ok, nevermind about that part.

Let's switch this up to the part about you not actually being interested in this girl. So why does it matter if she's not into you either?

I’m sorry. I don’t mean to sound rude, but this is what frustrates me about people. The fact that they ask questions like this when the end of the rabbit hole is right there for them to follow to the end. But people only seem to think as far as step 1, but there are 3 to 5 more steps in the rabbit hole before you get to the inevitable conclusion of it all, and what it all means in the end. I care about what she thinks because she’s a girl, and she is another point of data for me to use as a barometer for what women think of me. For my entire life, women have unanimously done to me precisely what she did - shun me, dismiss me, melt over other guys in front me etc. despite my best efforts to do what everyone says - i.e. cut loose, interact, laugh, show confidence, play it cool, tell some jokes, “improve myself”, put some effort into my appearance, etc etc etc... I’ve listened to the advice, I’ve taken it to heart, and put in some effort. It has gotten me nowhere. I know it takes work and doesn’t just happen, but it should be THIS remarkably impossible. At some point you start to develop a strong sense that something must be majorly wrong with you, because you’re exhausted of other available conclusions to draw. Once that belief gets in your head, there doesn’t seem to be any going back. Now you feel like a heroin addict looking for a fix just because your brain tells you you need it, even though if you got it it wouldn’t bring you any happiness or satisfaction. The whole concept of dating, romance, and sex is effectively ruined for me now. I wouldn’t even know what to do with it if I got it, like a dog chasing a deer. It’s just pure biological impulses and the related human emotions to those impulses that are driving me at this point. If I ended up getting a piece, I would be so psychologically/emotionally-impaired, and of such low confidence and high resentment that I couldn’t even go through with it anyway. I’d be like “you can just ******* keep it”. I’m mentally done.
 
Not that I’m considering suicide or anything, but I’m starting to see how others who’ve done it get to where they were mentally. I’ve always had suicidal thoughts since I can remember, but I used to wonder how those who actually went through with it got to where they were mentally, because I can only imagine that it’s the most absolutely empty, dark, devoid place a human could experience. I’m starting to understand that hopelessness and emptiness. You run out of places to turn. Nobody cares. Nobody reaches out to you. Nobody listens or cares when you do seek their time/help. It just gets to the point you don’t want to live anymore.
 
Again, perhaps you are too focused on the "red" spectrum of light.

I personally don't subscribe to, 'self-improvement'.  I am timid and shy.  No way in ******* HELL (well, never say never) will I ever have the confidence of strong woman who, 'doesn't give a fresia'.  I give a fresia (I care).  Some times you can care, WAY too much, about things that are unimportant.  I care about what some one at the grocery store may have thought about me a good 15 minutes after the encounter ended.  Most likely for them, they didn't give a honeysuckle to begin with; and, if they did, it's probably more their problem than mine.

Anyway, my point is, if you are 5'8" feet tall; then, yeah no honeysuckle, trying to be 6'3" is not going to work.  If you are 4'9", start using a stool.  An apple tree bears apple fruits.  Why expect it to bear pears, or pineapples? 

There are some things in life we absolutely can NOT change.  Other things, we have relatively easy control over; such as, turning on a light switch.  One extreme is black and the other is white.  Life has a LOT of room for a LOT of grays, vagueness, and such (even some color).

It seems to me like you have spent a lot of time trying to make yourself 6'3" feet tall, when you are in fact 5'8" feet tall.  It's very very easy for me to, 'describe', my, 'understanding', of your situation.  It's not so easy to appreciate it.  I can tell you, from my own opinion, though, we are living in a time, where EVERYONE is envious of EVERYONE else.  Never, have people, seemed to want what some one else has so much (at least in the U.S., it seems, but, I digress).

In psychology circles, you may here about, "black and white/all or nothing" thinking.  I hear you say, "I am not confident and ladies just don't want my propane and propane accessories, therefore I must stop selling propane and propane accessories."  It's a ******* black screen, man.  It's all black.  You have had some female(s) ask you a few questions about a social encounter in this thread of yours, concerning your woes.  I imagine she is quite knowledgeable about how, she, as a female, views certain social situations.  She, may, or may not have been able to provide some small advice, and at the very least, gave you the time of day.  Even if that's one tiny blue dot on your black screen, at least the screen still works.

You can watch comedian after comedian lament all the woes of feminine discourses in this world.  honeysuckle, maybe that's it.  Take up comedy.  Get into drama.  And there are women out there right now going through EXACTLY what you are going through (except maybe they still live with their parents and don't have six figures coming in).

At the very least, you are NOT alone, SPECIFICALLY, in your circumstance.  I suppose I'm not trying to give you answers or advice as much as state again, some major themes.

For one, maybe, try to pull the thumb back a bit.  For another, I agree with you completely.  I, myself, am not confident and outgoing, why waste time and energy trying to make an apple tree honeysuckle out pineapples?  Third, now that I am not wasting energy trying to be 6'3" when I am 5'8", what can I use that unspent energy doing?  Perhaps I can produce better apples?  

There are people who go about life the wrong way till they are on their deathbed and after all that wasted time and energy, finally, figure it out.  Some people don't even figure it out at all.  I hope I'm not one of either of those; but, my point is you, you can spend ENORMOUS amounts of time on something that turns out to be a completely useless failure.  These things happen in human life, and have happened; but, on the positive, some times that great scientific discovery happens as a random accident completely unrelated to years of endeavors that ultimately failed.

If you suck at being a sexy woman magnet; join the club, man.  If everything is either black or white, you can't even watch black and white television.  You need some grays.  And if you can get that far, maybe you can introduce some color in there.

Or, to throw away all that horseshit I just typed; even more simply put, some times when working on a tough puzzle, you have to take a long break to make any further progress.  This is an experiential fact.  Or like studying for a test.  You can only study for so long before your mind just can't absorb any more honeysuckle and you need to go stare at a cow in a field for 3 hours to detox and let it all sink in while you recharge.

----
oh, also. Concerning your, "fire side failure"... at least you tried... I asked a woman out from a college class a few years ago. I waited till the very last class, after the test was taken, to finally get the nerve to ask her for a cup of coffee. Turns out she had a boyfriend already; but, didn't mind seeing about a friendship. I was visibly hurt over the, PERCEIVED, rejection of her having a boyfriend to even try to accept an offer of friendship. She was a real sweet heart, about it, too; told me it was good that I asked. So. Better to have tried and failed, then to have never tried at all...

..and all that jazz. At least I tried. I failed, and I failed pretty hard; but, wow, I had the courage to at least ask.
 
kaetic said:
So why does it matter if she's not into you either? 

As he said, after nothing but 100% failure each new rejection starts to have a ominous significance to it, confirming the growing suspicion that it's your fate to be alone. It's about more than this particular girl. Shouldn't be that hard to understand really (unless you don't want to understand...)
 
Wardour said:
As he said,  after nothing but 100% failure each new rejection starts to have a ominous significance to it, confirming the growing suspicion that it's your fate to be alone. It's about more than this particular girl. Shouldn't be that hard to understand really (unless you don't want to understand...)

Precisely. You get it!

I guess I just need to make other plans besides life.
 
I know this thread is old, but I had a few more things to say.

I don’t even know how to accept love or adulation at this point. I don’t even know how to respond to it, or what to do with it. I’ve never had it. Not once has a woman ever looked upon me with favor or desire.

Maybe it’s just ws well, because I know that there is no way a woman could ever want me anyway. It’s such a truth I can almost feel it. It like it’s a natural law of the universe.

I don’t believe that there is much of a reason for me to continue. I think that this truth uncovers other truths. Undesirability is undesirability. It is a signifier that one is of no value, and most likely weak, incompetent, and incapable. I don’t believe life is for me. It has proven that to me time and again. I think it’s best I threw in the towel.
 
I just posted elsewhere about "rejection consciousness". I believe what we believe about ourselves is in our consciousness. If it's negative we attract more of the same. Ask if it applies to you. Read post if you can and let me know.
 
There’s not really much else to say. I know for a fact that it’s impossible for me to attract women. I don’t need to “give myself a chance”. It’s not hard to figure out where you stand. It’s very intuitive. When you’re an undesirable, you know it. It’s just that simple. It’s always kind of amusing how everyone will say things like “what makes you believe that about yourself?” As if the explanation must be something other than the fact that I’m undesirable. People avoid truth at all costs. They’ll never make the leap to admit that it actually is because I’m undesirable. It always has to be guised as “my lacking confidence”, or “being negative”. 

I suppose it’s just as well that I’m undesirable and no woman will ever want me. There’s nothing inherently bad about that in the scheme of things. But forgive me for not wanting to stick around anymore if that’s how it’s going to be.
 

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