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#1
Delete 

I'm venting, maybe looking for support, maybe some people who can vaguely relate - but instead, as usual, I'm getting nasty, hurtful responses. And they barely read what I wrote, in this thread and others, and seemed to have missed all the important and main points. 

Also, the bottom line is that I struggle to an extreme in life - probably much more than they do - in my everyday life. 

I probably won't delete my account immediately, but eventually, after a short break.
#2
LOL I'm going to be an asshole (partially), but you have a damn list!

and yes, I also made a list but about myself; because I think we have a problem there: If you're looking for an archetype instead of actually discovering someone, you are gonna have a bad time. Because mostly, people have no clue of what they want. I see a very detailed and honestly annoyingly specific set of traits you seem perfectly fine worth having, like if "it's not much". And yet, you don't seem interested in justifying any of those preferences with what you can offer in return. You had responses in dating apps, that's miles away from what many men get in years, are "used" to slim guys? So, I'm guessing you have dated (?), if so, how is that forever alone? Why would any guy with those traits be at your reach? what would they get of out it? Do you see the level of magnitude some people have to what you consider suffering? You can find a guy, it's just that he just happens to be in the "chubby, not quite interesting or progressive" side of the dating pool. Lower your standards for god sake.
Here's my list:
- She must be alive.
- Between 18 and 38.
- Not crazy or monumentally unlikeable.
I'm actually David Blane.
#3
If you haven't dated before, you will not understand. You, too, would not want to date an elephant woman.

If a woman were interested in you, and you found her seriously unappealing - you'd reject her, too.

And I explained, in great detail, in this thread and others - that I have severe anxiety around guys I like - and that makes me off-putting, even uglier, and undesirable to them. And I'm comfortable, with no anxiety, around guys I DON'T like - so the "real" me comes out, and they like me, and they're attracted. But no matter how much I try, I cannot get myself to like them.

Try being in my situation. It's unbearable having to settle with someone you truly dislike in all ways.

If an obese, hideous, dumb, boring, lowbrow girl was into you - would you like her back? Would you be willing to date her? I'd say, definitely not.

I don't think I have much standards - I just want someone I'm COMFORTABLE with. The reason I have the list is because I've been on dates, in the past, with guys who were the opposite of what I'm naturally drawn to - and that was unbearable for me. I'm from an elitist, snooty, educated area, so everything about my area is who I am - I just want a guy who's roughly the equivalent of me - it's unbearable settling for someone who's offensive to me in all ways.

It's extremely painful if the only people who see my real, good self are the ones I dislike - they see my non-anxious self, which is better-looking and likeable. In contrast, the guys I like - I'm anxious and uncomfortable around them, so I seem uglier and more undesirable to them, and they want nothing to do with me.

The other girl I talked with who has this problem finds it unbearable, too.

My suffering is very extreme - emotional agony, insomnia, etc. - for many complicated reasons - not limited to not being able to find a guy where the attraction is MUTUAL. If you look through all my posts, including from my previous username, QuietDesperation (without the 2.0) - then you'd understand me and my various unbearable difficulties more.

I have to stress that I know you, and all other guys, have more stringent standards than what you've listed. You surely do not want an obese, dumb, troll with a hideous face.

I knew of a heavyset guy, a Forever Alone, who said he won't date fat girls - even though he's fat himself.

So people all have preferences. You probably just don't know them yet, or you refused to post them because you're trying to argue hard against me.

Men are just as picky as women, if not more so. I wouldn't say I'm the least bit picky - it's that if someone is the opposite of what naturally appeals to me, then it's incredibly painful and ungratifying for me to spend any time, much my life with them. Can you imagine being in my shoes? Just turn into me - I'd GLADLY switch places with you.

People want to be with people that they LIKE - that they innately find APPEALING. Otherwise, it's extremely painful having to settle to the bottom, which is what I have to do - because I'm only comfortable and non-anxious around the "bottom" - I have anxiety which makes me come off undesirable around the ones I actually LIKE.

I've tried EXTREMELY hard over the years to like, and have empathy for, the only guys who see my true self - but it's extremely painful and ungratifying. Why be in a relationship if it just gives you extreme pain and suffering?

YES, I have tried dating guys that I found unappealing in all/most ways - and it was unbearable. I tried imagining my life with them, and I cannot. You'd feel the same way with women that you find unappealing in all ways.
#4
You're looking for a well educated, average to above average creative/hipster type from a middle class background. Like a lot of women. Probably none of us would qualify. Good luck.

'Public Ivy League' with a grad/professional degree is a high standard. The shared political outlook thing I can understand though.
#5
(07-12-2019, 01:16 PM)Xpendable Wrote: Here's my list:
- She must be alive.
- Between 18 and 38.
- Not crazy or monumentally unlikeable.

That's bullshit, everyone has preferences, being less desirable doesn't free you from that. You're not going to be able to date someone you can't find attractive and what would be the point.
#6
@ardour No, that's not really a requirements list - I specifically stated those are the types I've responded to on dating apps. Just that. Not that I've gotten beyond that in recent years because of my face problem, in addition to the weird anxiety I suffer from.

I'm from hipster/artsy/bougie central - so naturally, the qualities I'm looking for in a guy are the traits that I have myself. Of course you'd want someone who's roughly your own equivalent, and with traits that you find appealing.

Has anyone else ever been stuck with ONLY people that you find unappealing? The complete opposite of your ideal traits, and the traits you have yourself?

As I've said before, literally EVERYONE in my area has those characteristics I've listed - they're ALL OVER the dating apps. But I'm stuck because of my face problem AND the fact I'm anxious/undesirable around the guys I like, and relaxed/desirable around the ones I don't like. So I can only settle for the ones I don't like in any way, who are the completely opposite of what's appealing to me. And in my extensive experience with them, it's been unbearable.

Seriously, would any of you want to spend any time, much less your whole life, with someone who's the complete opposite of who you are, and with traits that are very unappealing to you, whether physically or otherwise? NO.

I went to a top Public Ivy - and most people around me went to better. I'm not requiring grad/professional - but most guys I've responded to do have that. I'm from probably the most educated part of the country.

At least you understand the shared political outlook. I don't require an ultra-progressive SJW who's spouting SJW jargon with every sentence - maybe that'd be a turnoff to me. Just run of the mill liberal-leaning. Just not a Trump supporter who's wrapped up within the red bubble. That's so important not just for the politics itself, but what goes along with it. Politically liberal people tend to have similar interests, worldview, education, etc. as I do. Politically conservative people (or what they might call moderate, but I'd see it as conservative) tend to have nothing in common with me in terms of interests, worldview, education, upbringing, etc.

I've tried, but I simply cannot spend my life with someone who is completely unappealing to me in all ways.

You guys try dating a girl you find unappealing in all ways - then you'll understand.

And I'd gladly switch places with you, too, ardour. It's a horrendous life as me. Just go through my shoes, and you'll probably commit suicide in day.

(07-12-2019, 02:38 PM)ardour Wrote:
(07-12-2019, 01:16 PM)Xpendable Wrote: Here's my list:
- She must be alive.
- Between 18 and 38.
- Not crazy or monumentally unlikeable.

That's bullshit, everyone has preferences, being less desirable doesn't free you from that. You're not going to be able to date someone you can't find attractive at all, and what would be the point.

Yes, I've been stuck with guys I found unattractive physically and in all other ways. There's no point in that. I've tried my darn hardest to like them and have empathy for them, for a long time - but that's only caused me great pain and suffering. Also, my family/others have disliked the unattractive, uneducated guys I've "dated," so that caused a lot of pain and stress for me, too.
#7
It’s a highish standard given the fact you probably require he make a decent living on top of it (favouring STEM, not hipsters). It's not exactly broad given the combination of requirements.

"And I'd gladly switch places with you, too, ardour. It's a horrendous life as me. Just go through my shoes, and you'll probably commit suicide in day”

It's not been exactly shits and giggles for me either. Balding at 15, harassed and excluded until the last year of school, spent my young adult life friendless hiding under a hat at university… then at 22 had to find out that my father (I strongly resemble physically) was a brutal child molester and deal with all the suspicion around me because of that. Insecure, passive personality women can't tolerate. Never dated and middle aged now. You've had some ego validation from the guys you're "stuck with" whether you think it counts or not. Just about every femcel has some kind of dating history it seems.
#8
(07-12-2019, 03:22 PM)ardour Wrote: It’s a highish standard given the fact that you probably require he make a decent living on top of it (favouring STEM, not hipsters) You have a particular type.

"And I'd gladly switch places with you, too, ardour. It's a horrendous life as me. Just go through my shoes, and you'll probably commit suicide in day”

Not been exactly shits and giggles for me either. Balding at 15, harassed and excluded school until the last year, spent my young adult life friendless hiding under a hat at university, called “gross” by women on a regular basis… then at 22 had to find out that my father (I strongly resemble physically) was a brutal child molester and deal with all the suspicion around me  because of that. Never dated. Hopelssly insecure, passive personality, all the things women can't tolerate.  You've had some ego validation from the guys you're "stuck with" whether you think it counts or not. Kind of aggravating to finally get the full story around that.

Nah, I said a bunch of times that EVERYONE in my area is like that. I live in the most highly-educated part of the US, probably. My siblings/relatives all have Ivy/Public Ivy equivalents, grad/professional degrees, and high-end jobs. It's the vibe the of my area. It's just what I'm used to. Look at the dating apps in my area - most people have the top schools and grad degrees. 

Actually, in my area, there are many affluent STEM types (techies) who are ALSO artsy and hipster. In fact, that goes hand in hand. Like I said, I'm not requiring the grad/professional school - I just said those are the types I tended to respond to. Just something ideal, but not necessary. 

Nah, I'd rather switch places with anyone. Probably even the people who supposedly dive into the sewers in India, or the Indian women who clean people's feces in those very old-fashioned latrines. 

I'm treated horrifically everyday - I get disgusted looks everywhere. I'm an extremely broken, traumatized person. I'm seen as subhuman. It's very complicated. I have ugly looks - just less ugly, and less undesirable, around the ones I dislike. 

Even if you've never dated, I'm sure you still have standards. As you said to Xpendable - you don't want to date a woman you didn't find attractive at all - what's the point? And attractiveness isn't just physical - but many other things as well.
#9
I have a couple of questions and I hope I have not accidentally read over already given answers.

In the beginning you listed guys you "responded" to. Does that mean you responded to their profiles (approached them) or to messages that were sent your way from these types (you were approached)? I assumed the former because of the facial deformity you mentioned which is presented as rather obvious and would put people off. Looks as a gatekeeper and all that. Not that I have any way to judge accurately without picture evidence. My girlfriend also struggles with general unattractiveness in various facets and while I could see it objectively it was never at odds with my personal standards - i.e. I don't like layer cake make-up faces.

Personally I don't believe in dating sites and have always met people through forums and sites which were based on common interests. So I've never found myself in places where one would look specifically for a romantic partner. Having observed the situation and read many people's stories, it seems very dysfunctional and downright counterproductive for people who are average or below.

Does your anxiety also manifest in online settings or does that provide a safer platform to interact with potential partners and to present yourself accurately?

PS: Are you currently employed in the field you studied?
Sometimes I wake up in the morning and I go...
[Image: d8mV4rP.gif]
#10
(07-13-2019, 01:44 AM)Rodent Wrote: I have a couple of questions and I hope I have not accidentally read over already given answers.

In the beginning you listed guys you "responded" to. Does that mean you responded to their profiles (approached them) or to messages that were sent your way from these types (you were approached)? I assumed the former because of the facial deformity you mentioned which is presented as rather obvious and would put people off. Looks as a gatekeeper and all that. Not that I have any way to judge accurately without picture evidence. My girlfriend also struggles with general unattractiveness in various facets and while I could see it objectively it was never at odds with my personal standards - i.e. I don't like layer cake make-up faces.

Personally I don't believe in dating sites and have always met people through forums and sites which were based on common interests. So I've never found myself in places where one would look specifically for a romantic partner. Having observed the situation and read many people's stories, it seems very dysfunctional and downright counterproductive for people who are average or below.

Does your anxiety also manifest in online settings or does that provide a safer platform to interact with potential partners and to present yourself accurately?


I've just gotten nasty responses from 2 users in this thread - and they've failed to thoroughly read what I've written, in my first message of this thread, and in my responses to them. And they've failed to remember what I've written previously, too. I don't blame them that much - it's complicated, and they can't remember all the details of some dumb poster they dislike so much. 

To answer your question - I've stated previously that I used to be pretty/attractive, with no disfigurement. I had a really great face. The guys I've responded to on dating apps - they were mutual swipes. Or in the older days of dating sites - they were mostly guys who messaged me. After the face problem, I've no longer been able to date via apps/sites, or get anywhere in person, e.g. at meetups. Obviously. 


And I have to emphasize a few points again, which those 2 users keep failing to pick up on:

1. I'm now ugly (wasn't before) - but I'm less ugly around guys I'm not attracted to in every way. I have severe anxiety around the ones I'm attracted to, in any ways, and that makes me come off uglier and less desirable. 

2. I live in a unique area, where EVERYONE is highly educated (often with grad degrees), affluent, artsy, creative, and hipster. Including the techies around here. I don't have high standards for my area - it's just how most people are around here, and they're most guys on dating sites/apps in my area. 

3. I don't have high standards - I myself am artsy/cultured/well-read/intellectual/liberal and went to elite schools. And I'm told I'm interesting, radiant, fun, easy to talk to, good social skills, etc. I'm aesthetic and well-dressed. So whatever I listed in "guys I've responded to on dating apps" - that's what I am. So in my list, I'm only listing guys I responded to (previously when I was pretty) because they're my equivalent - nothing more

Not many people can relate to this, but it's unbearable dating/spending a lot of time with someone that doesn't meet your needs in any way. 

4. Those 2 users failed to respond to my questions/comments on whether they'd date a Susan Boyle, if she were within their age limit - or morbidly obese women. Even though those 2 guys never dated - they have standards, too. They would also reject women they didn't find attractive at all - what's the point? To paraphrase one of them, who's kind of hypocritical, and most people are. 


I'm not looking for anyone in a romantic sense. Mostly, I'm fine with being alone, without a partner. Just felt the need to post all this because this site is so focused on having a gf/bf/significant other. 

My questions to you:
-Are you decent/good-looking? Why are you willing to date an unattractive woman who looks objectively unattractive to you? What else does she bring to the table? 

Unattractive people often have great qualities in other areas, are much nicer, and much more lenient in their tastes. But not all unattractive people necessarily bring that much to the table.


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