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Fixation On Yourself

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Tfranklinyo

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I notice there is a subsection on lonely people who seem very fixated on their loneliness and the causes. I have heard there is a chemical cause for depression and a practical one. Practical meaning there a reasons you should be depressed ie loss of a child. This kind is made worse by self indulgent behavior. I wonder if it’s the same with loneliness. I wonder if they really tried to worry about others and not so much themselves if they’d still struggle to connect. Thoughts?
 

Adamridge79

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My depression is chemical, and being treated with wonderful medication that let's me function quite well. My loneliness is an accumulation of lacking confidence in social settings, and the opposite gender, and from therapies telling me the 'old ways' I used were unhealthy. Which, to be fair, they really were. I don't get the hang-up about friends. I'm fine with aquantinces. But no, I don't need to hang. I'm just now supposed to look for an equal. I use this platform to see if on...let's equate it to a medium most here can grasp. If I'm a level 2 whatever and I need to engage a level, what, 12? I have to kill a bunch of hogs, or chickens or whatever easy shit to level up to that one, this is practice? I dunno.
 

orangecat

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Many use this site to vent as they may not have anyone else to turn to or maybe can't find or afford good therapy. I don't think they mean to be fixated or to be self indulgent, some just get stuck in a cycle of rumination and feel really trapped in their situation. Some also may struggle with personality disorders thus may find it very challenging to connect with others. In the end of day, they must decide for themselves to get better and break that cycle. We can only listen and try our best to support them.
 

TropicalStarfish

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Many use this site to vent as they may not have anyone else to turn to or maybe can't find or afford good therapy. I don't think they mean to be fixated or to be self indulgent, some just get stuck in a cycle of rumination and feel really trapped in their situation. Some also may struggle with personality disorders thus may find it very challenging to connect with others. In the end of day, they must decide for themselves to get better and break that cycle. We can only listen and try our best to support them.
I was going to write some long drawn out reply, which I'll still post; but, I think orangecat put it quite well. Some times, we only have output, and have our input closed off, whether we do that consciously, sub-consciously, or without even intending to... We just have to be kind, patient, and understanding of one another: tolerant.

Here was my mess of words...
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The whole, 'chemical imbalance,' stuff that people are fed is an absolute lie. I would suggest reading some Thomas Szasz, who is long since passed now; but, he did a pretty extensive examination of his field, many years ago. There are plenty of modern books about the subject too. One on my shelf right now is called, "Anatomy of an Epidemic," by Robert Whitaker. I'm sure there are many more books, by many more authors. There is also the SSRI stories website.

There is a plethora of information out there, all of which, in my research, suggests, the societies we live in, are absolutely, completely blind deaf and dumb, in many, many respects.

However, to your point, I think a complex set of particular circumstances, can lead a person into a sort of maze within their own mind, without a bread crumb trail, to find their way back out.

A lot of problem situations people will find themselves in, often are the type of problem, that can't be fixed very easily, expediantly, or at all; so, for the sake of brevity, expediency, and having nothing better to offer, a lot of medical or psychological professionals will fall back on the only tools they do have at hand; and this is not very unlike the witch-doctor trying to cure a novel virus by expelling the bad spirits through some arcane ritual. And, often times, whether the treatment is effective or not, comes down to whether the placebo is believed or not.

Let's say for example, your birth, your very existence, was the result of an accidental pregnancy by a mother AND father, that would have much rather preferred you didn't happen; but, they felt compelled by duty, obligation, and guilt to get married and raise you. You would find yourself with a mother who, in honesty, experiences you only as a nuisance, and perhaps a father who busies himself at work, to get away from having to be at the house, being a father.

Now imagine the psychological impact that would have. Really think about it. That child would basically grow up, with this unspoken truth, that he/she/etc.. was never really wanted. Now if this child, makes it into adult hood, with out some sort of self-destructive habit (colloquially referred to as an, 'addiction'), that would be a damn miracle.

So, when this child, now grown, finds themselves in the grips of a self-destructive habit, again they are met with deceit from both angles. One side offers a soothing balm to their constant psychological pain (the empty void they feel of never having been truly wanted), and the other side offers them, 'help,' from their addiction (often times this help is forced upon people, by others, if the circumstances aren't so great). Their problem is labeled an, 'addiction.' However, that's the symptom.

The real problem, is they never knew what it was to be raised by a genuinely loving family. They feel empty inside. They feel worthless. They are never good enough, in their own mind, and quite likely to others as well. But that problem never even gets recognized, much less addressed, and mentioned. At best, if they are fortunate and lucky, they may discover some new kind of fulfilling activity or people in life, to get beyond their natural tendency to self-destruct. And even that, being the best possible case scenario, serves only to give people the absolute wrong impression. It just reinforces the idea that the symptom was the problem; and the treatment, whether it was coercively forced upon them or not, was the answer. And that false answer, serves only to continue to keep the real, root, problems, in the dark, where they continue to reoccur.

So, people have written entire books on this and related topics, one of whom I've already stated. But, back to the point...

There is no dichotomy between chemical depression and genuine sadness. The former is an outright lie, whether useful or not (and for some, it may prove useful; drugs, including psychiatric ones, can change moods), and the latter is something everyone will experience. Do you ever hear anyone talk about chemical imbalances that cause people to be permanently happy and lead amazing, fulfilling lives? Of course not, that sounds absurd; and so it is. The closest you could come to a truth in that statement is that, 'it's genetic,' and the research has already been shown to reflect the fact that what is genetic and what is environmental is always about a 50/50 split. There are a myriad of identical twin studies to reflect that.

So we have nature and we have nurture. And that, to your point, is what some people may struggle with. There may be some people that were very well equipped with knowledge, circumstances, opportunities, and so forth, to really fight a sustained mental state of despair, such that, they could overcome it. While others, may be overwhelmed by it, lacking in knowledge or circumstances or opportunities, and so forth, such that, it conquers them, and leaves them bested at every turn.

I make no excuses for myself or anyone else, concerning things like, 'feeling sorry for oneself,' 'being bitter,' 'being hostile,' 'being closed minded,' 'being defeatest,' 'being pessimistic and negative,' and all the other things that can come with a negative, poor, and hopeless outlook. Despite that, the absolutely astonishing amount of ignorance, I witness, on a day to day basis, leaves me quite astounded; however, not the least bit surprised, that people find their problems to be so numerous. So, it's no wonder, we all tend to struggle so much.

These days, a growing divide seems to be occurring between two types of people. I'll call one side the, 'pull yourself up by your bootstraps,' side; and the other side is the, 'I'll hold your hand and help you,' side. I think both of those approaches have immensely great value. Tough love, some times, is the real trick. Other times, some one needs a guiding hand.

The only problem I see, is that whether some one is inclined to dispense tough-love, or, the guiding hand; most likely, they are woefully misinformed; and, that's what scares me the most...

As for me, I think a more dynamic, eclectic, and better informed approach is warranted in many circumstances these days; but, most of us, just don't know any better...

When there are 100 mouths to feed and only a few loves of bread and one chicken; the best answer is to make sure some one in the crowd knows mathematical division and is adept at influencing people (heh)...
 
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