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Free speech online has officially hit a new low...

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Memyself

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That's definitely different to what I'm talking about, lol.. obviously if you're working at a job, you have an obligation to follow the rules set by the employer (given that they aren't unreasonable). And I agree about religion, that's why I speak against it so much.
What are you talking about? It seems that any consequence is considered as being canceled. Is it media, what?
 

Memyself

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Naw, people have the right to remain silent themselves, but what makes it cancel culture is when they attempt to silence the people that have the views which oppose their own.
What does silencing mean to you? Backlash? Wanting someone vile out of the public eye? Don’t you think ignored opinions are a form of canceling? I bet the ignored would disagree.
 

Rodent

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I think it's proper cancelling when a mob forms that pressures your employer into firing you even though your statements are not in violation of any company policy, let alone any laws. It's a kind of economic pressure. Boycotts have always happened and for all kinds of reasons, perhaps just on a smaller scale. It's not always easy to judge what the real economic and reputational impact of a small mob putting pressure on companies (or individuals) is. After all, you can have relatively benign opinions like liking pineapple on pizza and you might still find a handful of people online that are willing to send you death threats for it.

To be honest, I think people have also been too irresponsible with regards to what to are saying out loud while using their real name for a long time. People thinking that social media is a private space, like your own living room, while it clearly isn't. There are instances of "cancelling" that are just the consequence of people effectively ratting each other out for what they've said online. Sometimes even illegal activities.

What I'm also wary of is humor and this little thing called context getting lost in this war. There is an overarching line of thought where everything is harmful to someone somewhere out there. But different people do have different standards for what's offensive or grotesque that are all still rooted within the realm of legality.

The best thing about the internet is that everybody can communicate with everyone. And the worst thing about the internet is that everybody can communicate with everyone.
 

Richard_39

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I think it's proper cancelling when a mob forms that pressures your employer into firing you even though your statements are not in violation of any company policy, let alone any laws. It's a kind of economic pressure. Boycotts have always happened and for all kinds of reasons, perhaps just on a smaller scale. It's not always easy to judge what the real economic and reputational impact of a small mob putting pressure on companies (or individuals) is. After all, you can have relatively benign opinions like liking pineapple on pizza and you might still find a handful of people online that are willing to send you death threats for it.

To be honest, I think people have also been too irresponsible with regards to what to are saying out loud while using their real name for a long time. People thinking that social media is a private space, like your own living room, while it clearly isn't. There are instances of "cancelling" that are just the consequence of people effectively ratting each other out for what they've said online. Sometimes even illegal activities.

What I'm also wary of is humor and this little thing called context getting lost in this war. There is an overarching line of thought where everything is harmful to someone somewhere out there. But different people do have different standards for what's offensive or grotesque that are all still rooted within the realm of legality.

The best thing about the internet is that everybody can communicate with everyone. And the worst thing about the internet is that everybody can communicate with everyone.
Humor.
I don't know if you ever watched the John Cleese interview where he speaks about political correctedness and it's impact on humor, but it's very informative. I think that when what is arguably one of the funiest men of the last few decades speaks about the dangers correctness has on humor, people should pay close attention. He's been criticized for some of his comments by people who know very little of humor and I think that's objectively unfair and very worrisome...
 

Memyself

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Humor.
I don't know if you ever watched the John Cleese interview where he speaks about political correctedness and it's impact on humor, but it's very informative. I think that when what is arguably one of the funiest men of the last few decades speaks about the dangers correctness has on humor, people should pay close attention. He's been criticized for some of his comments by people who know very little of humor and I think that's objectively unfair and very worrisome...
I agree with you, but IMO some jokes should never be considered funny, like mocking disability. In before times, it wasn’t possible to push back on this. Dunno. What do you think about that? Will you clap and laugh, would you roll eyes, would you laugh but feel dirty. It all very complicated.
 

Richard_39

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I agree with you, but IMO some jokes should never be considered funny, like mocking disability. In before times, it wasn’t possible to push back on this. Dunno. What do you think about that? Will you clap and laugh, would you roll eyes, would you laugh but feel dirty. It all very complicated.
You're opening Pandora's box. Who gets to objectively decide who is funny, what, where, when?
Either anything is, or nothing is. If you start censoring anything, it'll become the only logical conclusion.
A blind man walks into a bar. Good thing a doctor was there.
That's a disability joke. It may be lighthearted to me, but somewhere, somehow, someONE, will think it's the most disgusting thing they ever read and want to sue me and ban me for it. There's that many opinions on the planet.
Should it be? I think the results of censorship are far worse than anger at a distasteful joke.
If something is truly horrible, it should be criticised by many. But if it's hidden to everyone, it'll never get criticised and we'll have learned nothing out of it.

Edit: I specifically mean humor, here, though. It's it's own specific niche, in my opinion, when we talk about Freedom of Speech, as opposed to say, running for politics or a CEO's opinions online. Minus' posting below reminded me that, for example, freedom of speech online isn't a right, it's a privilege granted by whoever hosts the website, as such that entity does have a right to moderate it's content as it sees fit, and that's fine. It's tricky, it's not always good, but it's fine.
 
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ardour

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We're already half way down a slippery slope. Those who don't conform to current ideas on gender for example can be fired for refusing to play the game and address people via made up pronouns. That ends up infringing on their employee's basic rights. Organizations tend to take the safe road overreacting out of fear of public disapproval, but there's a limit to what an employer can demand from employees.
 
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Adamridge79

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I may be hitting wide of the mark, and if so, I apologize. The whole atmosphere of pronouns puts me a bit wrong footed, but only because it's new and I'm still trying to understand it fully. I mean, I get the premise, and I work in a highly inclusive business, I just try my best to address people how they prefer. I know I'll mess up, that's inevitable, I just try to stick with they or them when talking about that person to another. I do sincerely hope that anyone I do encounter knows my....confusion is solely from a lack of experience, and not malicious.
 

Minus

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You realize only the US government is obligated to abide by the First Amendment. Private companies have no obligation and are free to censor anyone at their whims.
You are right but it is more fun to gripe about it as if it did apply to private companies, ya know, calm a 'right' that never existed.
 

TheSkaFish

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The thing I find a little weird is...it's like, sure, freedom of speech might only apply to the government, and not private companies, in a legal sense. But at the same time, freedom of speech is more than just a law, it's part of our values. So when a company acts in that way, it does feel a little bit fascist/totalitarian. Which is not what the free world is supposed to be about.

And then you get into who, exactly, decides what speech is free and what is not. Eventually you might run into problems with their personal biases, since no one can be 100% objective. And with the whole thing being automated, you could have people getting banned just for telling people inside jokes or something, since automated programs can't read people's intent.

Like I said, I'm not really concerned with it on Facebook since I don't participate in the kind of stuff people have been getting banned for, so I don't have that much of an opinion. But at the same time, idk.

The thing I really don't like is that I heard you can get banned for old comments from years ago, out of the blue. I don't know if it's true or not but if it is, that's some bullshit.
 

TheRealCallie

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There are terms of service and fine print on everything. If you sign whatever it is or agree to it, you are therefore bound to honor them or face the consequences of them. It has nothing to do with whether or not your "freedom" has been taken away. You AGREED to the terms. You don't HAVE to use Facebook or Twitter or this forum, you CHOOSE to, so yeah, sorry, but your arguments are entirely invalid.

That said, I do think places like Facebook and Twitter are getting a little extreme with their censorship.
 

A02

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Facebook has gotten out of hand with it's biased censorship. It even has certain words blacklisted so that if you even use them in a sentence, it gives you a warning. I just happened to use one of those words twice within a week, and had my privileges for leaving comments on FB posts revoked for 24 hrs..
Not just words, but any statements they don't agree with, get the flag as well.. So much for free speech on the world's largest social media platform..

I got two more flags within the last day, and now they've blocked my acnt from commenting on posts for three days.. So much for having an original thought that doesn't agree with the mainstream. Free speech is officially dead..

And worse yet, these pricks don't want you to contact them to refute anything.. Only their opinions matter in our lives.. Fuck Facebook.. Corporate scumbags..

Side note, I thank someone for these forums. This is probably one of the only places left on the net where I can still speak my mind without being outright censored or banned (and if other places exist, I don't currently know of them..).

I mean, seriously, are people really that offended, or threatened by words from strangers on the internet? I mean, if someone's sending you emails like "I'm going to come to your house and kill you", That's one thing, and should be taken very seriously. But if you simply voice words, statements, or phrases that someone disagrees with, well, they should suck it up and get over it.. The internet is for everyone, not just the precious snowflakes..
thats why i stick to forums ive been banned like 24 times off of discord banned from insta twitter etc and ip banned on reddit
 

Memyself

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So no red line anything goes. Should kids be allowed to mock disabled classmate? I am very interested in topic of free speech and censorship. How do we create a more perfect Union if we keep making each other miserable. Life is hard for many
There are terms of service and fine print on everything. If you sign whatever it is or agree to it, you are therefore bound to honor them or face the consequences of them. It has nothing to do with whether or not your "freedom" has been taken away. You AGREED to the terms. You don't HAVE to use Facebook or Twitter or this forum, you CHOOSE to, so yeah, sorry, but your arguments are entirely invalid.

That said, I do think places like Facebook and Twitter are getting a little extreme with their censorship.
It’s artificial intelligence that polices platforms. if you object suspension, it’s arbitrary if it gets reversed. if one gets reported , it’s extremely biased weather or not you broke the rules. Also, there is more leniency for well known users. Some deserved some not, it Is what it is. I was better off not knowing how vile people are, but social media exposed it and there is no going back.
 

TheRealCallie

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So no red line anything goes. Should kids be allowed to mock disabled classmate? I am very interested in topic of free speech and censorship. How do we create a more perfect Union if we keep making each other miserable. Life is hard for many

It’s artificial intelligence that polices platforms. if you object suspension, it’s arbitrary if it gets reversed. if one gets reported , it’s extremely biased weather or not you broke the rules. Also, there is more leniency for well known users. Some deserved some not, it Is what it is. I was better off not knowing how vile people are, but social media exposed it and there is no going back.

It's a little more complicated than AI. AI picks out specific words to flag it, but there are actually people looking at that stuff too.
 

Memyself

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It's a little more complicated than AI. AI picks out specific words to flag it, but there are actually people looking at that stuff too.
Yes there are content moderators.
“Facebook employs about 15,000 content moderators directly or indirectly. If they have three million posts to moderate each day, that's 200 per person: 25 each and every hour in an eight-hour shift. That's under 150 seconds to decide if a post meets or violates community standards.”

These “villains” have PTSD from all the disgusting things they see.

 
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