Might just be poor social skills + being unlikeable

[ardour]

According to Myers-Briggs I'm consistently INFP-T after testing a few times. Apparently the most common 'lonely' personality type is the low agreeability, low openness spectrum type.

But a disagreeable individual is at least more likely to succeed in their career and can come across as assertive, slot in somewhere.

It seems like the worst combination for men is actually agreeableness + low conscientiousness (i.e. laziness) combined with neuroticism and a desire for approval - the last two being utterly repellent.

For a while I thought my social failures were the result of bullying and trying to fit into the wrong crowd as a young person, but during the last few years of going to various geek hobby meetups, it turns out I have general problems relating to others. A lot of them didn't like me either. I suspected as much. I think a few of them considered me unintelligent and there wasn't as much in common as I assumed. At least with those arseholes 20 years ago you knew where you stood.

I'm in the habit of 'reaching out' too frequently with suggestions for activities. It's often poorly timed. I loathe this about myself. On the other hand people have hinted I seem uninterested in others, so no winning there, basically. It's probably as simple as a lack of reading situations well and adjusting accordingly. (Social skills 101 again.)

One online female acquaintance told me "you are making people hate you!" I resented it at the time but see what she meant. But chances to develop a more stable identity past university are infrequent. At this point it feels like you're what you'll always be and the fact I'm struggling with the same problems I did as a teenager doesn't leave room for much hope.

I'd need to toughen up somehow if I wanted to make something of this wretched middle-aged existence but the opportunities aren't there.

 

[TropicalStarfish]

Today is the first day of the rest of your life, man. Dig it. And if you can't dig it, at least try...

If I could think my way out of my problems, I'd have had it all figured out, by now.. Make your own opportunities if life won't provide them.

In my experience, feeling sorry for myself, has pushed a lot of people away. It's hard not to do, but once you push away enough people, you're confronted with the same lonliness you were running from anyway... Personally, I think it's okay to suffer, and express that you are suffering; but, you have to be careful how you do it, and to whom you share your suffering with, else it just ends up adding to your suffering... In my experience with despair, rumination, and brooding, anyway..

Side opinion: People don't need to toughen up; people just confuse ignorance and rudeness with strength. It's not.

 

[TropicalStarfish]

nm

 

[CenotaphGirl]

I think you are someone who is afraid of failure. You marvel at others who throw caution to the wind whilst you sit through life with the seatbelt of judgement clipped on via your peers.

I think your trials have made you tough, tougher than you realise. Its only when you realise you try to destroy yourself to get back in the order and box your peers put you in.

I want you to win more than most on here, but you first have to burn the seatbelts, break the chains and be who you truly are. No more editing your posts 1000 times to make sure you people please to the max, be who you are. I cant wait to meet him

 

[okidoke]

It sounds like you're realising your perceived weaknesses about yourself, so now you can work on them. I don't think it's "toughening up" that is required. That just creates a hardshelled, insensitve and emotionless butthead. You just need to do some self-improvement, confidence building, bring out the positive things about you more. There are avenues for improving such things.

 

[user 148069]

before you edited your post, you mentioned about saying things you think others want to hear. First, don't do because it's called being fake. Others won't get to know the real you. You also mentioned that people sorta talk past you like you're invisible. Would you consider yourself soft spoken? It may be that you just need to speak up a bit louder to make yourself heard. I have experienced this too, you're not alone.

For a while I thought my social failures were the result of bullying and trying to fit into the wrong crowd as a young person, but during the last few years of going to various geek hobby meetups, it turns out I have general problems relating to others. A lot of them didn't like me either. I suspected as much. I think a few of them considered me unintelligent and there wasn't as much in common as I assumed.

Bullying can have lasting effects. What did you meant when you say a lot don't like you? Do they go out of their way to avoid you? Sometimes many people can be as just shy and not very sociable too, maybe they are also concerned that you may not like them too. I myself think like this a lot, I assume a lot of people don't like me too.
Do you like the people at the geek hobby meetups? You don't need to answer here but be honest with yourself. If you like them then try talking to them otherwise don't force yourself to socialize.

But chances to develop a more stable identity past university are infrequent. At this point it feels like you're what you'll always be and the fact I'm struggling with the same problems I did as a teenager doesn't leave room for much hope.

this one i disagree, I was looking for some answer on Quorra to the question "At what age in your life you genuinely stop caring what others think of you?"
many answers were people in their mid 40, 50s and even 60s where they said they only achieved this mindset at these ages.

 

[ardour]

before you edited your post, you mentioned about saying things you think others want to hear. First, don't do because it's called being fake. Others won't get to know the real you. You also mentioned that people sorta talk past you like you're invisible. Would you consider yourself soft spoken? It may be that you just need to speak up a bit louder to make yourself heard. I have experienced this too, you're not alone.

Bullying can have lasting effects. What did you meant when you say a lot don't like you? Do they go out of their way to avoid you? Sometimes many people can be as just shy and not very sociable too, maybe they are also concerned that you may not like them too. I myself think like this a lot, I assume a lot of people don't like me too.
Do you like the people at the geek hobby meetups? You don't need to answer here but be honest with yourself. If you like them then try talking to them otherwise don't force yourself to socialize.


this one i disagree, I was looking for some answer on Quorra to the question "At what age in your life you genuinely stop caring what others think of you?"
many answers were people in their mid 40, 50s and even 60s where they said they only achieved this mindset at these ages.

It's mostly a feeling, but it's usually accurate. Just because people are into certain things doesn't mean they're more accepting of awkwardness. You're still expected to be engaging, witty, fun. I made the mistake of assuming otherwise. Not everyone dislikes me. One guy, we went to his house a couple of times for games and drinks. The last few times I've been to the games store/cafe he ignored me as if I weren't there, talked around me. I doubt I'll be getting invites from that group again.

 

[okidoke]

It's mostly a feeling, but it's usually accurate. Just because people are into certain things doesn't mean they're more accepting of awkwardness. You're still expected to be engaging, witty, fun. I made the mistake of assuming I'd just be accepted. Not everyone dislikes me. One guy, we went to his house a couple of times for games and drinks. The last few times I've been to the games store/cafe he ignored me as if I weren't there, talked around me. I doubt I'll be getting invites from that group again.

well you engage more than me. i only have one real friend that I do anything with. i know others, but i never get invited anywhere. if i'm to remedy that, i guess i'll just have to find more places to engage with others.

 

[M_also_lonely]

According to My... of this wretched middle-aged existence but the opportunities aren't there.

(1/2)
I have observed two approaches to personal development. The first involves changing external factors with the hope that progress will eventually lead to a change in the internal factors. The second, rarer approach works in reverse, where people begin with the internal factors. However, the second approach seems impractical because if life has shown me its uglier side, how can I heal without seeing any change in it? How can a person who has been a loser or a victim see life in a positive light?

I have tried both ways. The first approach is usually suggested, where one starts by cleaning their room, getting a haircut, exercising, fixing their diet, applying for a better job, saving money, and so on. You feel like you are moving forward. But there comes a point where you realize that this long sprint was all an illusion.

That sense of meaninglessness starts to haunt you again. You are successful, and people treat you differently. But now that bothers you as well because you found out that they are only there because of your success. This hurts more than being alone. You realize that the other guy didn't need to have all those things and qualities that you had to get in order to arrive at peace. The not-fit guy also got married, the once average student also has a good income, but you had to make all the effort just to get what they have without the effort. It is like running on a treadmill. You ran and got fit, but you are in the same place because you were running on a treadmill. And you have to keep running because if you take a pause, the meaninglessness will haunt you again.

I find the second approach interesting. Can you change the internal aspects first? What does it mean and how does it work?
(1/2)

 

[M_also_lonely]

(2/2)
When my grandfather saw me in a miserable condition, he inquired everything. He gave me an astonishing idea. He showed me a picture of Krishna on the battlefield, dressed a bright yellow dress, studded in golden jewelry, riding the most magnificent chariot, blowing the conch to commence the war. (Referring to Mahabharata war.)
He asked, "Look at this picture, look at his face. Do you see any fragment of concern, worry, fear, threat in him? Before you go fulfill your so called ambitions and attempt to conquer the world, can you develop a grace as divine as him?"
I was stunned. He seems to be in absolute comfort, with a smile, as if there is no war.
I said, "But he is a God, a literal deity."
"Yes, but also take note that he is in a battle. Just like Rama."
It seems like the lives of our Gods were quite miserable. One of them was born in a jail, another was sent to exile and his wife got kidnapped.
He continued, "So you can't make the excuse that he was above the struggles of life."

"How do I attain such a divine grace?"
He said, "Fall in love with it. With the idea of having it."
__

This is interesting. I stared at that picture all night. I wondered what it would be like to have the mental health of a literal deity. The total absence of fear throughout. The moment you develop an admiration of it, it starts coming to you. I was a gynophobe, I was drugged by my own roommates. I was called a potential rapist by the girl I loved, because of my the way my eyes looked back then. But it still worked for me. I was more interested in what it would feel like to be like Krishna, than in how to do so.
(Now, I am not preaching any religion here. Whether you are a believer or not is not the subject, but the underlying context of my message is important.)

I think everyone should try this approach. If you want good mental health, develop an admiration for good mental health, instead of living with the concern of not having good mental health. If you want to be confident, admire confident people, for their confidence, instead of seeing them as competitors who are ahead of you.
It is an amazing feeling to be confident, and having a positive outlook towards life. Not that there are no struggles, but there's an assurance that one will give their best to overcome them.
Try to attain such qualities first. The social skills will follow.