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Separating Yourself From Family

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Waldo P. Schmeer

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Right off the cuff I want to identify that this post is about building the strength to separate yourself from your own family, like when you block people on social media. Sometimes your family is the most toxic group of people you're ever going to meet, and you'll never know it because TV and media teaches you to excuse this behavior from family.

I grew up with the learning that family is the exception to everything and that you are somehow under some obligation to swallow all of the toxicity that they can humanly dole out. And we see it on TV, movies, books, comics, plays, and quite literally any other medium of entertainment where the family is portrayed. And just like any OTHER concept portrayed in mediums of entertainment (such as magic, superpowers, the occult, supernatural, etc), its all a load of made up mess. You are under absolutely ZERO obligation to suffer the toxicity of your own family. They are not exempt from being bad people, and often, they ARE the bad people in your life. And you are not exempt from the wear and tear of dealing with such people. You, just like everybody else, deserve to rest, eat well, have peace, enjoy life, enjoy friendship, enjoy quiet time, enjoy alone time, enjoy companionship if you wish it.

USING MYSELF AS THE EXAMPLE FOR THIS POST
In my culture, its drilled into your head from a young age that you ARE the retirement plan for your parents/elders when they get sick and old. And while that is a nice notion and ¨noble" and all of that, its cruel, its terrible, and its a selfish thing to want for your children. Every family has one: The ¨family concierge¨. The ¨concierge¨ is the ONE (seemingly) person in the family who knows anything about anything- finances, legal matters, healthcare, insurance, working, finances, finances, finances. The concierge is a driver, handyman/woman, spiritual advisor, financial advisor, psychiatrist, psychologist, home health aid, chef/cook, time traveler, etc. Its not that we know how/can do all these things... its that the rest of the family is so toxic that once a ¨concierge¨ is identified, that is it- you'll be left to do absolutely everything - whether you can do it or not. No one will help you lift a finger to save your life. And its all out of ¨love¨... because you're just trying to do the ¨right thing¨ by taking care of your people. And its all based on nothing more than some toxic fake moral code that we are force fed throughout our lives. I am my family's concierge.

MY ADVICE
For younger people who may be reading this who can maybe already identify that you're the sibling who always has to translate things for your parents, or somehow YOU are the one who always has to go to Dr appointments with them. That´s really great of you that you have the heart to want to help your family. But please... PLEASE start thinking about what this means for your future. I never thought about my future. Help is like a drug- people can also get used to it- and even addicted to it. Because help isn't always just finding that difficult problem out with somebody-- sometimes, it can make that person feel good. It makes them feel good to the point where they get used to it. They may want more. More help. More help. More help. MORE. Until eventually your help eventually changes to your responsibility. Then the toxic behaviors don´t hide themselves anymore. Suddenly, the day you try to put yourself first is the day they will make some innocuous mention of your being selfish- it doesn't matter how many years of dedication you've put into your family. They will be used it by then. And suddenly, your life will not matter to anyone but yourself. You'll stop taking care of yourself. You'll stop going to the gym. You'll stop eating well, you'll stop visiting friends. Then you'll stop having friends altogether. You'll stop dressing normally. You'll stop having an identity.. period. You will, in essence, be nothing more than a human extra life (like from a video game) to those around you.

If you want to really help someone, teach them to help themselves. Then if that doesn't take, its not ¨on you¨ anymore. Just be ok with walking away. Life is hard- and its GOING to be hard for anyone who as to live it- AKA anyone who exists. This also means your family. They are not exempt from life.

WHERE I CURRENTLY AM
I am in a place of heavy frustration in my life. Although I will say that will the benefit and experience from hindsight, my frustration is more controlled because I can also use the hindsight I possess to see that this has been my entire adult life. I just had my 37th birthday the other day. I spent it in a physical rehabilitation center with my mother who had a stroke last month. And as I expected, she is lazing her way through the whole ordeal. I dont want anyone reading this to think that Im calling a stroke victim lazy. Im a calling the person who has to go through the recovery lazy. Because I knew the person before the person became a stroke victim. We are currently back home. arrangements had to be made to get her back home. A wheelchair ramp had to be built. The furniture had to be sold to make room for hospital equipment. The hospital equipment was an ordeal itself to arrange.

While in the rehab center, she didn't participate. Didn't do her therapies. Constantly talked trash on the nurses (so the stroke didn't impact the toxic part of her brain). She gossiped about the staff. She talked down to the staff who couldn't speak her language. All in all- nothing to do w the stroke. This is who she was before the stroke- but now she just cant move and must rely on the kindness of the world to eat and clean her when she is incontinent.

When she sleeps, I look at her and I dont feel bad in the sense that Im sad this is happening. I feel frustrated like when you tell a little kid to not go on a rollercoaster after eating a ton of candy. Youre just annoyed that they didnt listen and now you have to clean up a mess. Well this is like that. She had a stroke due to high blood pressure. And instead of feeling sad I see her in this condition, I can remember all the times I did my job by making sure shes eating well, and getting rest, and using her sleep apnea machine. I check to make sure shes just not shoveling crap into her body like she always does.
¨Ma, you cant just live off butter a mayonaise and crackers¨
Her while laughing: ¨Oh, you know thats what I like to eat¨

¨Ma, please put on your apnea mask when you sleep at night. If something goes wrong with you, no one is going to life a finger to help me take care of you¨
Her while laughing: ¨Im indestructible¨

So please understand why I dont feel pity when I watch her suffer through the pains of a stroke. Because nothing that is happening is nothing that I haven't warned her about or tried to prevent through the sheer will of my intervention. I am just watching a child throw up after getting on a roller coaster after eating a ton of salty candy. The most infuriating thing to me is that it was done with the knowledge that I would be here to help.

WHAT ITS COSTING ME
To begin with, this is all costing me my peace. Not in a way where Im upset because this isn't my first rodeo and by this point Im just emotionally numb to anything. But losing your peace of mind is something that can happen to you no matter how dead your emotional nerves are.

A few months ago I met an amazing woman who I hit it off very well with. She is a brilliant woman who always has plenty to talk about and she is a doctor. We go out and have a great time and laugh and eat a really nice restaurants. And she shows genuine interest in my career and likes the kinds of movies and TV shows that I introduce her to. She spends the night at my apartment and we have amazing times together. And im going to lose her. The entire ordeal Im currently going through is not a foreign concept to me. Like I said, this isn't my first rodeo. There are times where I've had to cancel our meet ups and dates and sleepovers because of what Im currently experiencing. She´ll eventually lose interest because I am constantly physically exhausted, mentally drained, and emotionally numb. Many of the times when we talk, I have to act like I am present because it is the only thing that I can do to even feign a sense of not being totally drained and exhausted. At times, I cant even be intimate with her out of pure stress that im experiencing or overall physical tiredness.

Ive been here before with relationships in the past. They all eventually leave because I am too invested in taking care of my family. There have been 3 separate times in my life where a woman has wanted to marry me and eventually back off. Ive missed out on opportunities to travel and see the world. This is just a different kind of slavery.

I have two siblings and they never show their faces. They only appear when they need something from my parents. I have been labeled as angry and bitter for having written them off. Thats another thing about conciergehood- the concierge is always the villain, the bad cop, the ¨bad parent¨. No one will ever say ¨hey, Waldo is really tired and no one has been helping him¨.

Just dont do it. Your family can be addicted to help just like a drug and they dont care if your life itself is the price for the next ¨fix¨.
 

Sarah G

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I haven't cut ties with my family but I'm gradually broadening the space between us, mentally and emotionally. I already live in a different country to everyone except my adult son (who I will never expect or allow to take care of me). My parents are elderly but I'm not close to them emotionally so I'm conflicted by the guilt of expectation (I don't call them, just send cards). My brother has ghosted me and I'm over it. My sisters have their lives. I'm tired of walking behind people begging for crumbs of love, I'm just done with it.
I did read a useful book: Shadow Daughter, A Memoir of Estrangement by Harriet Brown.

My mum was quite abusive (probably undiagnosed BPD) and my dad was/is an alcoholic so I just don't feel obliged to be a perfect daughter for them. I'm not even planning on traveling to attend funerals as I have health problems and take care of my husband with health problems.
 
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Waldo P. Schmeer

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I haven't cut ties with my family but I'm gradually broadening the space between us, mentally and emotionally. I already live in a different country to everyone except my adult son (who I will never expect or allow to take care of me). My parents are elderly but I'm not close to them emotionally so I'm conflicted by the guilt of expectation (I don't call them, just send cards). My brother had ghosted me and I'm over it. My sisters have their lives. I'm tired of walking behind people begging for crumbs of love, I'm just done with it.
I did read a useful book: Shadow Daughter, A Memoir of Estrangement by Harriet Brown.

My mum was quite abusive (probably undiagnosed BPD) and my dad was/is an alcoholic so I just don't feel obliged to be a perfect daughter for them. I'm not even planning on traveling to attend funerals as I have health problems and take care of my husband with health problems.
Good on you Sarah- at least for being able to gradually create space with family. It sounds like you didn't have the easiest time growing up. That is not your fault and it sounds like your folks may have had stuff they hadn't worked out. And again, that is not your fault. People tend to get used to that ¨cookie cutter¨ image of what family is ¨supposed¨ to be.

Ill never understand how people just cant nut up and stay alone in life. The same way we come in.
 

Zen28

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I have experience with this subject so I'll bite. The first thing to say is that you are quite wrong.

It is true that some family members can turn bad. The element behind that is usually something like drugs. This is when they become complete liars, borrow and don't pay back, steal or turn violent. Addiction is not something that an addict eventually overcomes by themselves - they require intervention, one or more serious disasters (such as a debilitating injury), or they just stay addicted. Then there are mental disorders such as schizophrenia, and when the person fails to regularly take medication. That is what you call bad.

Antisocial behaviour, bullying, and financial/domestic leeching are other problems - however these are generally solvable. One way is by modifying your attitude. People are allowed to act as they please; there's no need to call them "toxic". There is a lot of talk today about toxicity, and a popular imperative that in order to live happily, you need to completely cut out the toxic people, presumably until they adjust themselves to your standard, or something. This is not realistic. You can choose your own behaviour, but you can't dictate or flaunt to others what is normal or acceptable.

Families are not perfect. If you have been pouring time, effort and money into a relationship, and do not receive in your opinion a fair return, then instead of continuing to give so much and complain about it (which hasn't worked), why not reduce what you give. If you're giving people extra attention and support who have never offered it back in kind and throwing away your own life opportunities, it is absolutely not the other persons' fault for you to make those decisions. It is your fault. You are simply not learning from the experiences you are getting.

If you're feeling emotionally drained and don't want this, then it is your job to not feel that way. It is not someone else's fault, and this is where the argument for "toxic people" falls flat - it is one person, blaming someone else, instead of taking responsibility which was theirs in the first place. You cannot shift the blame on others like this, even if you don't like them. How you feel is up to you to manage, and writing them off as "toxic" is a sly way of refusing that task you have as an adult.

Sure if you are continuing to make the same mistakes over and over again, you may work yourself up into a fury and in the heat of the moment, finally cut off all the "toxic people" after reading about it on the internet. Sounds great, now you're free and have your space! Now travel 5, 10, 15 years down the line, just you on your own, no birthdays, no Christmas, no memories, no photographs, no family. So if the responsibility talk doesn't get you on this decision, to cut off your most important relationships that you'll ever have, think about how you're going to feel.

This isn't supposed to be a dictation btw. Just my thoughts. I have also separated. My lesson was: don't. Things were bad for a long time but they could have been salvaged. Even if others had no intention of ever growing up, I could chosen to have. Now there's no chance and that has left me poorer.
 

Finished

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First I cut all ties with my family. Then I cut all ties with my so called friends. Then I cut all ties with all humans. Nobody knows or cares about me. Do I really exist? Maybe, maybe not. Life is so much simpler and far less dramatic.
 

Waldo P. Schmeer

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I have experience with this subject so I'll bite. The first thing to say is that you are quite wrong.

It is true that some family members can turn bad. The element behind that is usually something like drugs. This is when they become complete liars, borrow and don't pay back, steal or turn violent. Addiction is not something that an addict eventually overcomes by themselves - they require intervention, one or more serious disasters (such as a debilitating injury), or they just stay addicted. Then there are mental disorders such as schizophrenia, and when the person fails to regularly take medication. That is what you call bad.

Antisocial behaviour, bullying, and financial/domestic leeching are other problems - however these are generally solvable. One way is by modifying your attitude. People are allowed to act as they please; there's no need to call them "toxic". There is a lot of talk today about toxicity, and a popular imperative that in order to live happily, you need to completely cut out the toxic people, presumably until they adjust themselves to your standard, or something. This is not realistic. You can choose your own behaviour, but you can't dictate or flaunt to others what is normal or acceptable.

Families are not perfect. If you have been pouring time, effort and money into a relationship, and do not receive in your opinion a fair return, then instead of continuing to give so much and complain about it (which hasn't worked), why not reduce what you give. If you're giving people extra attention and support who have never offered it back in kind and throwing away your own life opportunities, it is absolutely not the other persons' fault for you to make those decisions. It is your fault. You are simply not learning from the experiences you are getting.

If you're feeling emotionally drained and don't want this, then it is your job to not feel that way. It is not someone else's fault, and this is where the argument for "toxic people" falls flat - it is one person, blaming someone else, instead of taking responsibility which was theirs in the first place. You cannot shift the blame on others like this, even if you don't like them. How you feel is up to you to manage, and writing them off as "toxic" is a sly way of refusing that task you have as an adult.

Sure if you are continuing to make the same mistakes over and over again, you may work yourself up into a fury and in the heat of the moment, finally cut off all the "toxic people" after reading about it on the internet. Sounds great, now you're free and have your space! Now travel 5, 10, 15 years down the line, just you on your own, no birthdays, no Christmas, no memories, no photographs, no family. So if the responsibility talk doesn't get you on this decision, to cut off your most important relationships that you'll ever have, think about how you're going to feel.

This isn't supposed to be a dictation btw. Just my thoughts. I have also separated. My lesson was: don't. Things were bad for a long time but they could have been salvaged. Even if others had no intention of ever growing up, I could chosen to have. Now there's no chance and that has left me poorer.
I really appreciate the time you took to respond. It sounds like you may have been speaking from experience- and given some of the things you mentioned, I don´t think you and I have quite lived the same lives. You mention being alone 5, 10, 15 etc years down the line on my own with no birthdays or christmas. I had a family and we didnt do those things. Everyone is here and healthy, and not one of them cares for these ¨special¨ days. So i don´t think we´re in the same boat. Sounds like you may have regrets of your own, but I don´t get how you are commiserating with me by implying that I am somehow dodging responsibilities when I am the ONLY family member who has stuck around to take care of these mentally unstable people in the first place. Also, when I say ¨mentally unstable¨, I am referring to clinical diagnosis´.

A lot of your post was basically the equivalent of telling a paraplegic to ¨walk it off¨. If people feel that the people around them are toxic, they don´t need to qualify it to anyone else. Flat out, this isn´t a good environment because I myself am not the most sound of mind. I do well when I am left on my own. But I can´t be alone as I wish because the toxic habitual bridge burners around me need help. So maybe I´m not the irresponsible person your post implied if I am fulfilling familial responsibilities.

I do think it was a little presumptuous of you to put quotation marks around ¨toxic people¨ as if I am making it up. But what else would you call a mother who´s #1 goal in life was to denigrate her husband in front of their children any chance she got? What else would you call a woman who has burnt every bridge in her life, including her own family and siblings because of their personal life choices (such as who they chose to marry or where they chose to live)? What would you call a man who threatened to kill his own sons in their sleep with a machete every single day? What do you call it when that same man would celebrate his family´s downfalls and hardships? These are people who I have witnessed celebrating the news of people being diagnosed with cancer. What would you call a man who constantly referred to his wife as a ¨whore¨ and beat her within an inch of her life in front of their children?
Hey man, if you miss your folks, you are more than welcome to have mine.

So yea, it sounds like you may have an impression that I have ¨Self Diagnosed¨ or get ideas from the internet. But this is the life that I live. And have lived. So if I need to vent on some random forum from time time, I´m sorry if it somehow put you out of your way. if you want to get together and commiserate sometime about our families and the way they used to beat the life out of us (IF you lived that life to begin with), I´d be happy to chat with you on a one on one.
 

Waldo P. Schmeer

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First I cut all ties with my family. Then I cut all ties with my so called friends. Then I cut all ties with all humans. Nobody knows or cares about me. Do I really exist? Maybe, maybe not. Life is so much simpler and far less dramatic.
We can agree on that. The less people, the less dramatic. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that and if it brings you peace, I applaud that. The good news is that I can confirm, you do exist. I will never understand how some people can never accept the fact that some of us just really DO need to be alone to function best and feel peace.

I toast to your ability to do quite literally whatever you like with you time on this rock.
 

Zen28

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I really appreciate the time you took to respond. It sounds like you may have been speaking from experience- and given some of the things you mentioned, I don´t think you and I have quite lived the same lives. You mention being alone 5, 10, 15 etc years down the line on my own with no birthdays or christmas. I had a family and we didnt do those things. Everyone is here and healthy, and not one of them cares for these ¨special¨ days. So i don´t think we´re in the same boat. Sounds like you may have regrets of your own, but I don´t get how you are commiserating with me by implying that I am somehow dodging responsibilities when I am the ONLY family member who has stuck around to take care of these mentally unstable people in the first place. Also, when I say ¨mentally unstable¨, I am referring to clinical diagnosis´.

A lot of your post was basically the equivalent of telling a paraplegic to ¨walk it off¨. If people feel that the people around them are toxic, they don´t need to qualify it to anyone else. Flat out, this isn´t a good environment because I myself am not the most sound of mind. I do well when I am left on my own. But I can´t be alone as I wish because the toxic habitual bridge burners around me need help. So maybe I´m not the irresponsible person your post implied if I am fulfilling familial responsibilities.

I do think it was a little presumptuous of you to put quotation marks around ¨toxic people¨ as if I am making it up. But what else would you call a mother who´s #1 goal in life was to denigrate her husband in front of their children any chance she got? What else would you call a woman who has burnt every bridge in her life, including her own family and siblings because of their personal life choices (such as who they chose to marry or where they chose to live)? What would you call a man who threatened to kill his own sons in their sleep with a machete every single day? What do you call it when that same man would celebrate his family´s downfalls and hardships? These are people who I have witnessed celebrating the news of people being diagnosed with cancer. What would you call a man who constantly referred to his wife as a ¨whore¨ and beat her within an inch of her life in front of their children?
Hey man, if you miss your folks, you are more than welcome to have mine.

So yea, it sounds like you may have an impression that I have ¨Self Diagnosed¨ or get ideas from the internet. But this is the life that I live. And have lived. So if I need to vent on some random forum from time time, I´m sorry if it somehow put you out of your way. if you want to get together and commiserate sometime about our families and the way they used to beat the life out of us (IF you lived that life to begin with), I´d be happy to chat with you on a one on one.
I am not referring to you Waldo. My main motivation is the trend of referring to other people as a disease. That might be acceptable terminology for a heated argument, however it is not a way to generally handle things, and not an excuse for deliberate long-term estrangement. Would you like it if someone wrote you off as "toxic"? How do you know your relations aren't doing the same thing? Is that a standard for how adults should act.

Whatever you have been through, not to belittle it, I guarantee: other people have been through worse and stuck it through. Family isn't a choice and you can't replace it. If they've violated you, you get nothing by secretly violating them back online, or competing with others about whose parents were or are the worst. Whatever events have transpired, you are still choosing to be involved despite not being satisfied or even receiving nudges that you aren't welcome. There is only one person responsible for that.

Did you invent this "toxic" thing yourself or did someone else? That's what makes me suspicious about this trend. It's a fun ride for a while, with all the branding and forums, however at some point you need to face reality. People are not "toxic" like some kind of contamination or virus. They are people and are allowed to act however they like, including who they marry, and where they go. If you're not picking that call up any more, that means nothing to them, it only hurts you. They are still going to do what they like whatever curses you use.

It is not about telling a paraplegic to walk it off. More like telling someone with two legs that they can. Why are you helping these people so much if you know there's no reason? Reduce or stop the help. Are you expecting that you'll get your lost opportunities back if you continue? You already know you can't. Calling them "toxic" is not a sign that they are a problem, but that the pain is greater to you than ever. There is a way of solving the entire ordeal immediately - rather continue to entertain the expectation that they'll change or you'll ever get anything for your sacrifices, let it go.

Again this is not about specifically you. Every situation is different. This trend for others to vent their frustrations at their loved ones by referring to them as a chemical spill is disappointing to me. It was easy to get sucked up in that and not understand that it didn't help the situation.
 

Waldo P. Schmeer

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I am not referring to you Waldo. My main motivation is the trend of referring to other people as a disease. That might be acceptable terminology for a heated argument, however it is not a way to generally handle things, and not an excuse for deliberate long-term estrangement. Would you like it if someone wrote you off as "toxic"? How do you know your relations aren't doing the same thing? Is that a standard for how adults should act.

Whatever you have been through, not to belittle it, I guarantee: other people have been through worse and stuck it through. Family isn't a choice and you can't replace it. If they've violated you, you get nothing by secretly violating them back online, or competing with others about whose parents were or are the worst. Whatever events have transpired, you are still choosing to be involved despite not being satisfied or even receiving nudges that you aren't welcome. There is only one person responsible for that.

Did you invent this "toxic" thing yourself or did someone else? That's what makes me suspicious about this trend. It's a fun ride for a while, with all the branding and forums, however at some point you need to face reality. People are not "toxic" like some kind of contamination or virus. They are people and are allowed to act however they like, including who they marry, and where they go. If you're not picking that call up any more, that means nothing to them, it only hurts you. They are still going to do what they like whatever curses you use.

It is not about telling a paraplegic to walk it off. More like telling someone with two legs that they can. Why are you helping these people so much if you know there's no reason? Reduce or stop the help. Are you expecting that you'll get your lost opportunities back if you continue? You already know you can't. Calling them "toxic" is not a sign that they are a problem, but that the pain is greater to you than ever. There is a way of solving the entire ordeal immediately - rather continue to entertain the expectation that they'll change or you'll ever get anything for your sacrifices, let it go.

Again this is not about specifically you. Every situation is different. This trend for others to vent their frustrations at their loved ones by referring to them as a chemical spill is disappointing to me. It was easy to get sucked up in that and not understand that it didn't help the situation.
Again, thanks for responding, I don´t understand what your points have to do with my situation, as much as I appreciate you taking the time to discuss.

The way you respond is as if there is only one uniform way to deal with these kinds of problems. I don´t ¨get anything¨ by ¨violating¨, as you put it, anyone online. Has it ever occurred to you that sometimes people use these forums as a device to be able to vent things that they otherwise would not be able to discuss in their everyday life?

You´re telling me that people cannot be toxic, but that just isn´t true. They can be toxic and they are. I´m sorry if that terminology just doesn´t sit well with you. Its a huge world and people express themselves in many ways, and often in ways that make sense to them. Youll never be able to control that as much as it bothers you.

Toxic people are people who withhold their relationships with you if you are not doing what they wish you to do. Toxic is when people only address you when they need something, but otherwise hide from you when you try to invite them to spend time as a family. Toxic is teaching your children that its ok to celebrate the misfortunes in other people´s lives, such as cancer, or losing their home. Toxic is pitting family members against each other to hide your own misdeeds.

You can apply whatever word to it that you like, but at the end of the day, you are allowed to block your own family from your life, like when you block people on social media. Nobody is held to some invisible standard to forcefully have to swallow all these negative behaviors just because you came out of the same hoo-ha, or because you share the same blood. You don´t really even seem too particularly bothered by a stranger who´s going through some of life´s drama than you are concerned with the way the stranger expresses. And I will also make it clear that I am not competing with you on who has it worse. I added context because it is very evident that you have the impression that life is the same exact experience for everyone, when in fact, everyone lives on a different world. You feel that everyone will have the same regrets as you. You feel that everyone will feel the same as you when you realize you dont have the same people around you.

Also, its not really constructive to tell people that ¨it can always be worse¨ or ¨other people have it worse¨. That´s the equivalent of telling someone that they aren´t allowed to experience and process all of life´s trials and tribulations however they have to because other people have their own set of problems. We ALL have problems. Mine aren´t any less because I wasn´t born with a different set of problems. We all go through the grinder at some point.

I´ve never understood people like you on forums who will argue a person their OWN feelings on a topic just because it doesn´t invoke the same feeling in you. Its not empathetic. And people like you contribute with ways of politely going ¨nuh uh¨ towards someone who experiences a completely different life than you. And to your point, YES, I am stopping this behavior once my mother finishes rehab. Thats why I am writing my family off. NO, I dont expect to get missed opportunities back, but I WILL get back my time so that I can continue forward in my life to experience things that *I* want to experience. Enjoy MY money the way I see fit, instead of bailing out my family from every problem. I want to enjoy the little bit of youth that I have left without having to be someone elses extra life. So thank you for the advice to tell me to stop doing what I am doing.... after I said that I am going to stop doing what I am doing. It never occurred to me.

Again, I am sorry my venting forced you to respond to someone because you didn´t like the way that the person expressed themselves, or if you thought that they should be handing a situation you´ve never been in the way you think you would if you were the one in the frying pan. But all the same, I respect that you have a different frying pan, and your own set of experiences and regrets, and I respect that.
 

Zen28

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Midlands, UK
Again, I am sorry my venting forced you to respond to someone because you didn´t like the way that the person expressed themselves, or if you thought that they should be handing a situation you´ve never been in the way you think you would if you were the one in the frying pan. But all the same, I respect that you have a different frying pan, and your own set of experiences and regrets, and I respect that.
Waldo, the more you subscribe to the trend that your family members are "toxic", and "vent" about it, the more the relationship will mean something to you, consciously and unconsciously. This will feed a never-ending cycle and impact your remaining relationships negatively. The solution is to stop trying to control other people's behaviour and drop your complaints with them to yourself.

If you don't understand why you are hearing this, it's because it comes from a source with experience. Nothing you've thrown at me is new. As I have said, this is not about you, it is about being against the popular trend to call family members "toxic" and become vulnerable to loneliness and isolation, all because those particular people did not met our expectations at that point in time.
 

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