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"Waiting" for love
(04-06-2019, 12:54 PM)ardour Wrote: People are counseling this guy to waste months, possibly years of his life waiting for something that in all likelihood won't happen.  She doesn't see him as a serious option, she wants to feel desirable again, probably after a bitter breakup with someone who didn't treat her so well.

My advice to him was "focus on yourself and your own life."

This idea of "waiting" and "wasting months" makes no sense to me, ardour.

If relationships are fun and positive, the duration of that connection can never be a waste of time - even if it doesn't culminate in something long term.

You learn more about yourself building relationships and that self-awareness will bring you closer to the partnership that will last forever.

Pretty much just "You reap what you sow".

If she doesn't make the same investment in him, then sure, time to walk away....but he's clearly interested and attracted, so why not try?
I'd also like to add that if the OP is in the "give me the relationship I want or I'll never talk to you again," it's not going to work anyway. No, I doubt he actually said that to her, but he's made it pretty clear in his posts that that's what it boils down to.
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Avoided reading anything but the first post, after seeing Callie's last post here which made me think "This guy must be a complete douchebag."

Nah, though I didn't read any of his other posts in here, but from the original post it doesn't seem that way. But here's what I will say.

Are you really getting nothing back, my dude? You've got her attention. You're getting her friendship. You get her time. You get to hear about her day. You're invested in the life of another. That's all friendship boils down to.

Always take care of yourself first and foremost, and never change who you are for another. But that doesn't mean you can't help someone through issues you have experience with if you're willing to.

Were you helping her with her issues because you saw she had similar issues, or were you helping her with her issues because you wanted to be with her? That's an important question to ask yourself and no one else. Because it influences greatly what you're going to say to her when trying to help her with those issues.

Were you trying to help her, or were you trying to steer her towards you? Because the latter is a bit of a "bad" thing to do, but I can see how it's easy to do it without even knowing you are doing it. As long as you're not her therapist, it's not really a big deal as long as you're not going to blow up on her if it doesn't go the way you want. If you do that, you'd be a complete douche. Don't be that guy. I've been that guy, yeah? It doesn't feel good.

Be her friend, talk about your issues together, focus on yourself though and taking care of your own life. Don't forget about her though, don't leave her unless she stops talking to you then yeah, I'd leave it because it feels worse to be the one hanging on. It may, over time, work out.

She also may start dating someone else, while telling you she's not ready. Definitely don't blow up on her at that point. Just leave her be and 100% focus on your own life. It's her life, and her choices. It might feel like you've been slighted if that happens, but that's just someone not knowing how to express their emotions, a lot of women seem to have this process of problem solving that hurts you because of their intentions to avoid hurting you. As fake as that may seem, shit happens. If someone comes along that just sparks her life up then so be it. Wish her the best and keep on truckin'.

Hope it works out, and if it doesn't, then buddy I hope it works out somewhere else.

And if you're someone who can't deal with "just being friends" IF that comes up, as it so often does, then don't at all feel bad about not wanting to. That's your decision, same as hers, to move on completely. Don't hang on, though, if you have no intentions to.
Don't let yourself get demonized for being someone who can't deal with that situation, either. A lot of people will say it's a shitty thing to do. To be friends with someone but have romantic intention for them and not wanting to be friends with them if they don't want to be with you. I don't see it that way. You've got no obligation to be put in or stay in that situation, as long as you're not creeping around after the fact you know? That's one of those "Okay, bye." Then you go find something that is going to work for you scenarios. Might hurt the girls feelings, but she'll live man.

Edits: After reading the whole thing, between Enpatsu and Ardour. Neither are wrong.
 Ardour is someone I agree with, but wish I didn't. Because much of what he says is true, real, and painful to accept.
 Enpatsu is someone I agree with because much of what he says is true, real, and extremely hard to find, but you hope for it.
Walk a middle line. Knowing that a lot of women will just use you, but some won't. Protect yourself, Respect yourself. But also respect others and know when to walk away.  That's the best you can do.
So, to update this.
First of all, please don't full on argue with each other, didn't mean to cause a fight with this thread.

The really worried, anxious and messed up part of me agrees with Ardour. But even if Ardour is 100% right, I'm not letting that stop me. I'm not giving up on women or love, and not this chick, not until I see this through one way or the other. As Moon Puppet said, it won't be a waste of time

Now, after reading his replies and having some 1on1 chats, I'm 100% agreeing with Enpatsu. He 100% described what I think and feel, and gave me some great advice. Sometimes tho you need to hear things from someone else to be sure about them, y'know? Make sure you're not being dumb, or putting yourself in a situation that you shouldn't.

@Callie, no, this is not a "my way or no way". I'm ofcourse not gonna force her in a relationship, or demand it to be exactly as I want it if we get in one, I'm not a cunt. The whole "i'll never talk to her again" thing, will happen only for me to get over her if she decides we won't be dating, not cause I didnt get what i wanted or whatever, but to heal up.

@Naizo, most of the help "i've given her" was before things changed, when we were just 2 good friends, the advices were based on personal experiences etc, but otherwise were completely unbiased. But even after I fell for her, I'm being as unbiased as I can, at least knowingly.
And I won't blow up on her, I never will. I honestly believe I've helped her through some things, it doesn't matter if we date or not, she finally found a person that she finally feels legit cares for her, that makes her feel like she's worth something for once, I am NOT gonna ruin that by being a horrible cunt no matter how this turns out. Even if this doesn't work out and I'll need to distance myself, I will make it clear to her that it's so I can take care of myself.
"You must be strong enough to go away from what you didn't deserve, and patient enough to wait for what you do"

That's dope bro. Respect.
Don't give up on women, just forget about this, regroup, join clubs or meetups in your local area – it’s easier than ever with facebook. Even online dating would be more worthwhile. You’re 25 already, every moment you waste crushing over this friend is time you could have spent looking for someone.

9 times out of 10 a non-committal attitude means 'no'. People telling you to go for it or whatever are apparently happy seeing someone throw away precious years of their 20's. It's irresponsible advice.
(04-07-2019, 02:29 PM)Naizo Wrote: She also may start dating someone else, while telling you she's not ready.

Highly likely.
TBH I kinda agree with Ardour to a point,  if she's already running hot and cold on you like you said in the OP then that isn't a good sign in my opinion, sounds kinda like she uses you as a self esteem boost or something.

Also if you're an very emotional type as you say then it's possible you've smothered her a bit and pushed her away which might be another reason for the hot and cold thing.
I feel this topic is a lost cause at this point. If I'm helping you best, let's just stick with the one-on-one messages and leave the rest of them out of it.
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