Loneliness- Genetic, younger years conditioning, or just plain self induced?

[Shetland]

Sorry if this seems heavy for a new member to post.

I suffer from loneliness and fail to make friends, and have spent a bit of time looking into it. I considered more recognised problems, but for now I'm attributing my state of mind to just loneliness.

Genetic- Could it be some people are just not meant to 'breed', or simply programmed to drive people away? For instance, a genetic issue within the family would need careful consideration regarding being 'passed down'.

Early Years Conditioning- I recenty came across something known as the 'triangle of insight'. Which suggests much of childhood behaviour and experience is reflected in our adult lives. Personally, I feel I have links to rejection in childhood, which I am oversensitve to in adult live (clearly not desirable when looking for new friendships).

Self induced- Is it actually all me? Or does perception, ('that looks like a victim', 'he has problems, might as well have some of mine' ) attitudes of others and such like also play a part. One observation I have made is how much easier it is to connect with people if your actually already accompanied- suggesting people 'fear the loner'.

A more general thing I have noted amongst 'non loners' is when you speak of loneliness, they assume you want a partner, when really you just want a sense of belonging.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?

 

[Lonesome Crow]

It's all of the above.

From my own experince....

My biological daughter sometimes acts like me and thinks like me.
Sometimes talking to her is like looking at myself in the mirror.
Other time she thinks and acts just like her mother.
Yet....I didnt raised her.
So I tend to believe there's some gentics going on beyound just her physical features.

I have a step father.
Sometimes Ive been accuse of acting just like him.
I also have a step daughter...She acts just like me or have simular traits.
So there's some conditioning happening.
Read plenty about how important it is in the first 8 years of our lives.

Then of course Im an aduilt. Im responsible for my own life. My own thoughts and feelings.
Self actuALIzations....I can re condition myself..change myself. Be whomever i wish and want to be.

We all want to belong somewhere...
An example is religion. People join religious groups because of a senne of wanting to belong.

 

[IgnoredOne]

What are your more recognized problems?

 

[LonelyInAtl]

Early Years Conditioning- I recenty came across something known as the 'triangle of insight'. Which suggests much of childhood behaviour and experience is reflected in our adult lives. Personally, I feel I have links to rejection in childhood, which I am oversensitve to in adult live (clearly not desirable when looking for new friendships).

I absolutely agree with this.

I'm relatively certain that a lot of my self-image issues and lack of ability to meet women comes from my early teen years. I was overweight from about 3rd grade up until 9th grade. Never had a gf, was teased, ostracized, couldn't get a date to our school dances (Homecoming and Valentines), etc. The summer after 9th grade I just said fresia IT and started walking, jogging, etc and had lost quite a bit of weight by the 10th grade. I played varsity football, was captain of the Math and Academic Bowl teams my last three years of HS, and did other extra-curricular things. However, the damage was done. I still felt unattractive and anxious around girls because of what happened in my pre/early teen years. I was rejected (rudely, in many cases) and hurt so many times I didn't want to take a chance because I figured it would be the same. I went on exactly 2 dates before I was in college. I didn't even kiss a girl until I was 17 and that was a friend's cousin who was only in town for a few weeks over the summer, so it was more like a summer romance.

Even into college, I still was very uneasy and most of my dates came from friends or meeting online. I can probably count on my fingers the times I've actually gone up to a girl in person and started a conversation. Probably on one hand.

o Vicki at a math competition in HS
o Georgia at a fraternity party
o Some girl I asked to dance at a party
o Some girl I asked to dance at a club and was told no

I can't really think of any more.

I got married and didn't have to worry about it for 16 years until she decided she loved another man. So, I'm back into the dating field now with almost no experience in meeting women. I've gained quite a bit of weight (but losing it) so I'm at even more of a disadvantage. Dating sites are out, so I've been trying out Meetup groups to get out and meet people. I've been to Meetups and seen 60 year old guys with more "game" in their little finger than I'd have in my entire body.

So, in essence, I would say that experiences during my younger years did carry over well into my adult life.

 

[Shetland]

What are your more recognized problems?

If by that you mean 'professionally recognised', none. Four consultations with docs at various stages of my life (I'm 40) have always ended with the conclusion 'there is nothing medically wrong'. Which, whilst I just want to feel content, I would accept a diagnosis and consequent treatment- I have no stigma about this. However, I feel the doctors are probably right, hence the conclusion that loneliness mimicks the milder symptoms of depression. Depression to me, would be the point I stop trying, would not bother working or taking part that is available to me that I enjoy. I These symptons include or have included;

Anxiety- literally waking up with heart pounding. Fear of the future, constant 'looking back' (to include sitiuations I wished I had handled differently for more positive results, wanting to recapture feelings of belonging etc'. Increase in smoking, eating rubbish. Not exactly jealousey, but lifestyle comparisons with those who seem 'better off'. Compromising myself just to be in situations I am not alone.

The last ten years have been difficult, with the last two forming a realisation nothing has worked out. I once lived in a city, now a tiny little place. There has never been any avenue for integration with anyone local, it's a depressing place with little going on. The stuff I enjoy is seasonal and involves travel. What friends I do have are not local, and have involved lives of their own making contact infrequent. Situation at the moment is job that requires me to be alone all day, and then being alone a lot when not working- it all blurrs into one mess and I just feel equally unhappy both working or at 'home'.

I can do alright, but don't! I could be in a situation with people and it feels fine, but I never seem to develop anything lasting from these encounters. There are times I feel great- I do a part time uni course and that seems to go fine as for as 'working relationships' are concerned, I do voluntary work in the Summer, and again, great. But I find there is nothing lasting I eventually take away from these opportunities. Therefore I am familiar with what I want to feel as normal... but have to return to places than make me feel 'abnormal'. It's makes for a difficult paradox.

---

It's all of the above.

From my own experince....

My biological daughter sometimes acts like me and thinks like me.
Sometimes talking to her is like looking at myself in the mirror.
Other time she thinks and acts just like her mother.
Yet....I didnt raised her.
So I tend to believe there's some gentics going on beyound just her physical features.

I have a step father.
Sometimes Ive been accuse of acting just like him.
I also have a step daughter...She acts just like me or have simular traits.
So there's some conditioning happening.
Read plenty about how important it is in the first 8 years of our lives.

Then of course Im an aduilt. Im responsible for my own life. My own thoughts and feelings.
Self actuALIzations....I can re condition myself..change myself. Be whomever i wish and want to be.

We all want to belong somewhere...
An example is religion. People join religious groups because of a senne of wanting to belong.

Thanks for that, I find it insightful. I'll be honest, I know I'm suffering somewhat from being alone, but at the same time I'm currerntly part time studying one to eventually work in one of the caring professions, which I am begining to feel slightly at odds with as my own life isn't quite right. Some of what I ask is self exploratory, but I'm also very interested in the 'bigger picture'. The genetic aspects are probably the hardest for me to figure out- there are no children in the family and asking too much of my parents about their history would probably be an unfair stress on them.

---

Early Years Conditioning- I recenty came across something known as the 'triangle of insight'. Which suggests much of childhood behaviour and experience is reflected in our adult lives. Personally, I feel I have links to rejection in childhood, which I am oversensitve to in adult live (clearly not desirable when looking for new friendships).

I absolutely agree with this.

I'm relatively certain that a lot of my self-image issues and lack of ability to meet women comes from my early teen years. I was overweight from about 3rd grade up until 9th grade. Never had a gf, was teased, ostracized, couldn't get a date to our school dances (Homecoming and Valentines), etc. The summer after 9th grade I just said fresia IT and started walking, jogging, etc and had lost quite a bit of weight by the 10th grade. I played varsity football, was captain of the Math and Academic Bowl teams my last three years of HS, and did other extra-curricular things. However, the damage was done. I still felt unattractive and anxious around girls because of what happened in my pre/early teen years. I was rejected (rudely, in many cases) and hurt so many times I didn't want to take a chance because I figured it would be the same. I went on exactly 2 dates before I was in college. I didn't even kiss a girl until I was 17 and that was a friend's cousin who was only in town for a few weeks over the summer, so it was more like a summer romance.

Even into college, I still was very uneasy and most of my dates came from friends or meeting online. I can probably count on my fingers the times I've actually gone up to a girl in person and started a conversation. Probably on one hand.

o Vicki at a math competition in HS
o Georgia at a fraternity party
o Some girl I asked to dance at a party
o Some girl I asked to dance at a club and was told no

I can't really think of any more.

I got married and didn't have to worry about it for 16 years until she decided she loved another man. So, I'm back into the dating field now with almost no experience in meeting women. I've gained quite a bit of weight (but losing it) so I'm at even more of a disadvantage. Dating sites are out, so I've been trying out Meetup groups to get out and meet people. I've been to Meetups and seen 60 year old guys with more "game" in their little finger than I'd have in my entire body.

So, in essence, I would say that experiences during my younger years did carry over well into my adult life.

Thanks for that, very honest and open.

Whilst I now feel 'early stuff' has been an issue, I know I have got to be mindful of not making too many excuses fro myself based on those revelations.

But I know there were minor bullying issues in my school years, not fitting in, not being good enough at anything, being compared to an older sibling- that sort of thing, and I feel I have been socially conditioned to think negatively. My reactions to rejection can be poor.

More recenty (as in the last ten years) I was with a girl, moved with her out of town when her job changed, split up, then it became a 'treading water' situation , both financially and socially.

Reflecting on some of what you say, when I split up I thought I must have another partner, and tried to find one. For me, I am now less driven by finding another partner- I feel one will appear if the time, circumstances and the match is right.

 

[Sci-Fi]

Interesting.

For me it would have to be Early Years Conditioning, I had a strict parent, was small for my age, got picked on a lot growing up, so that really did a number on my self esteem. People always told my mom how quiet and well behaved my brother and I were. That kind of stuck.

 

[Okiedokes]

Mostly Early Years Conditioning. I managed to put up a wall due to being picked on at such a young age that I have a hard time breaking through it to this day, and sometimes push away others because of it.

Genetic also.. with the anxiety and depression and w/e else that runs in my family.

 

[LonelyInAtl]

Genetic also.. with the anxiety and depression and w/e else that runs in my family.

I'm lucky....I don't have anything like that. I'm ok in groups and meeting new people. But when it comes to expressing interest in and asking out a woman..... Well, lets just say I'd rather walk over hot coals with gasoline soaked feet.

 

[beermaestro]

Genetic I do think some personality traits are inherited, but not in my case

Early Years Conditioning This one, to me, is the biggest influence of all. I grew up in a broken home (multiple divorces, and constant instability), and was bullied constantly in early school, so I know I have major trust and commitment issues. Get your head slammed into a locker a few times, or worse, and you tend to be a little circumspect around other people. I also crave routine, order and pattern (I am pretty much OCD from the earlier life of instability). These are not things which lend themselves well to the unpredictability of asserting oneself socially

Self induced- I must go to the gym. I must work full-time. I must go for long walks. I must sleep at least 8 hours a night, and make sure I am eating as healthy as possible. I must write.

So where does that leave time for social activity? In order to have a more social existence, I have to give up one or more of these things. This what I call the Great Struggle for Balance, because I'm just not sure if I want to lose one of the things I love.

And do not leave out..

Situational We live in a society (at least in the US) where people are pressured to be Movers and shakers, and to "find themselves." No one, of course, talks about the negative effect of this, which is the loss of cohesiveness and community. A lot of my friends and family moved all over the place, put their careers and the 'pursuit of happiness' before all else, the consequences be damned. Which is why I now find myself friendless...family-less... and sicker for it.

 

[Walley]

I think it's not necessarily generalized to one option or the other.
as some have already said, it can be both alot of times.
or sometimes the early childhood conditioning isn't fully realised until other events trigger them.

 

[hallstar]

I can't say I have ever looked to deep into but for me I would say genetic for me. My biggest problem is the shyness which has affected me my whole life. My Granddad was the same, but he managed to meet my Gran during WW2 although I know when she died in 88 he never got over and lived until he 2001 and thinking now makes me sad to think now that he most probably ended up a lonely old man although he did have 2 kids but he lived in Warwickshire where my Uncle also lived but my Mum moved away to marry my Dad in West Yorkshire so he won't have had much contact with many people.

Back to my issue, I am ok if I can spend time around people but I don't really get chance to. At work I am always having to be on the move in a warehouse so I only interact in passing which makes it difficult for me. And of course I live on my own in a quiet street.
This also might strange but I find if someone knows I am shy makes it difficult as I feel if I started a conversation they might go "Oh my God he spoke" stupid I know they won't do that but it reminds me of a story my Mum tells me about then when I was small when my teacher ran to the school gates smiling because I had talked. Having said all that even if they don't know I am shy I still find it difficult.
I think I also have trouble connecting physically with people when my Mum gives me a hug she mentions how I seem to flinch, but thinking about it I wonder if that could be related to an incident as a kid. I used to find my Gran intimidating because as quiet as my granddad was my Gran was loud but one day when they were visiting just as they were going I went up and hugged her and she smiled and talked about all the way home, any way she died a week later so maybe there is a fear there that if I hug back something bad will happen.

None of this has really stopped me doing things, travelled to the USA quite a few times, visit London, go to sports events, theatre,cinema but just always on my own. I sometimes get jealous when he see couple, groups and think it would be great to be part of that.

Thinking about it I wondered if there was an element of depression but I came to realise that I am just lonely which leaves me with low self esteem.

In summary I guess for me its mostly genetic which has put me in situations as a kid that have affected the way I do things today.

 

[ardour]

Early years conditioning #1. From what I've read "early years" means before about 6, with response patterns getting later re-enforcement.
It is of course self-enforcing; being vulnerable as a kid creates situations where you are picked on resulting in more anxiety and defensiveness.
How you choose to handle things, even as a child or teenager can't be ignored though. I dealt with things badly or not at all.

Fishing for return attention here perhaps, but your posts are really articulate and easy to relate to.