I'm the bad guy

LonelySutton · Sep 1, 2014

When I was younger I always fancied myself the "good guy". I was going to be the Luke Skywalker. I was the Professor X. But I don't know where things went south, but now, am the villian. Sometimes I watch "xmen" first class and can't relate at all to Charles Xavier. Almost everything that Magento says I shake my head with. Not just because it comes out of the mouth of Michael Fassbender. I don't believe in many of the tenants that I used to ... that good will always win over evil. That isn't true at all. That you win if you live your life in a good manner and the evil will get what is coming to them. In my experience... no way. I don't give to charity because I don't find it life affirming.. I find it foolish. The money is typically wasted. Sometimes the ends do justify the means. Just like fassy, I do believe that if you turn the other cheek, bullies will just keep slapping you. It does make you weak.

Anyone else?

Tiina63 · Sep 2, 2014

Often I can identify with the villain rather than the good guy as well in films and books and part of me wants him or her to get away with whatever they have done wrong. I agree that in real life evil often triumphs over good as well, that people don't always get what is coming to them. And I agree many bullies do go on hitting you if you try turning the other cheek. Life can be incredibly unfair and painful.
At the same time I think that each of us has the responsibility to try and increase the level of goodness in the world in small ways if not big ones. When it comes to charity I can understand your not wanting to give money as often it is wasted. But could you give some tins of food to your local foodbank each week as this won't be wasted?
I have read several of your psots on here and you don't come across as the 'bad guy' at all.

VanillaCreme · Sep 2, 2014

I guess one could argue that there is no good or evil, no right and wrong; Just two different sides going against each other. What one person thinks is wrong, one might think is right. What could be considered right, can be looked at as being wrong. Sometimes, it's okay to be like Jimmy and root for the bad guys in the movies, though. You would learn more from them than seeing the straight and narrow side all the time.

LonelySutton · Sep 2, 2014

Tiina63 said:
I have read several of your psots on here and you don't come across as the 'bad guy' at all.

Oh dear... then I am not doing it right. This is an issue too. I come across as the good guy while the reality is that I am the bad guy. I think it is a defense mechanism. I want people to like me and typically they do that by my seeming nice. But I am not nice. I am secretly evil.

I have a co-worker who seems to think i am friends with him. I have been friendly but a week or so ago he kind of reprimanded me. I felt like he only did that because I have that "nice" act and he felt like he could without consequences. And he is right because I still have the act, but inside now, he is on my enemy list. It is particularly hard to have to tolerate him, he almost has increased his contact with me to try to smooth things out, but really I hate him.

I have thought about it.. if I had to take a life to protect others I would, and I bet I would not have any trouble with it. Whenever anything is happening -- where I have to get ahead -- calling the train, I will literally push people out of the way to get their first. I do plot revenge against my enemys... even though I know it won't change anything. I used to help people out at work but now I am very "it isn't my job" -- I just now see the error of my ways. When I helped out I never got any credit for it. No matter how obvious it was. You only get credit for helping out the "right" people.

I sit in my corner plotting my revenge every day.

VanillaCreme · Sep 2, 2014

LonelySutton said:
Tiina63 said:

I have read several of your psots on here and you don't come across as the 'bad guy' at all.

Click to expand...

Oh dear... then I am not doing it right. This is an issue too. I come across as the good guy while the reality is that I am the bad guy. I think it is a defense mechanism. I want people to like me and typically they do that by my seeming nice. But I am not nice. I am secretly evil.

I have a co-worker who seems to think i am friends with him. I have been friendly but a week or so ago he kind of reprimanded me. I felt like he only did that because I have that "nice" act and he felt like he could without consequences. And he is right because I still have the act, but inside now, he is on my enemy list. It is particularly hard to have to tolerate him, he almost has increased his contact with me to try to smooth things out, but really I hate him.

I have thought about it.. if I had to take a life to protect others I would, and I bet I would not have any trouble with it. Whenever anything is happening -- where I have to get ahead -- calling the train, I will literally push people out of the way to get their first. I do plot revenge against my enemys... even though I know it won't change anything. I used to help people out at work but now I am very "it isn't my job" -- I just now see the error of my ways. When I helped out I never got any credit for it. No matter how obvious it was. You only get credit for helping out the "right" people.

I sit in my corner plotting my revenge every day.

Not doing what right? Not acting right? Not coming across how you feel? Plotting revenge for what? That's going to take up so much time and energy, and it's for something that - in the bigger picture - doesn't matter. Just from this post alone, you have to realize how much you stress yourself out.

TheSkaFish · Sep 2, 2014

LonelySutton said:
I do believe that if you turn the other cheek, bullies will just keep slapping you. It does make you weak.

Anyone else?

I feel the same way. Growing up it was definitely like that. But when you get to the adult world it's like, the only way to avoid getting slapped around or taken advantage of is if you have money and/or intellect and/or talent. It's hard for me because when I'm angry I can't think clearly, but thinking clearly is exactly what I need to do in order to build myself up to the point where they can't slap me anymore.

Sometimes it gets bad. I'll fantasize about kicking the crap out of the ones I love to hate, the tattooed, tough-guy "badasses" and how good it would feel to beat them down, how good it would feel to injure them, shame them, take something from them. I don't think it would bother me at all. But it's just hot air. I'm not actually doing anything about it, and physically attacking them won't get me what I want. My only hope at beating them is to just become better in life than them, which takes clarity and I can't get clear when I'm angry.

Locke · Sep 3, 2014

LonelySutton said:
I don't believe in many of the tenants that I used to ... that good will always win over evil. That isn't true at all. That you win if you live your life in a good manner and the evil will get what is coming to them. In my experience... no way. I don't give to charity because I don't find it life affirming.. I find it foolish. The money is typically wasted.

If you believe or give anything with expectations attached, you're probably going to be disappointed. It sounds like your expectations were crushed so often that you turned bitter and stopped caring about anyone but yourself. I feel a little sorry for you. Whatever happened to make you think like that must have hurt.

As for charities: You can't give money to anyone and have a right to tell them what to do with it. You gave it to them, so it's no longer yours. Bigger charities may waste money, I have no idea. But there are almost always local charities that can be supported, and what they do with donations is usually obvious. I give to charity out of every paycheck. I have it, other people need it. I don't expect to feel fulfilled, I just want to help people.

LonelySutton said:
I have a co-worker who seems to think i am friends with him. I have been friendly but a week or so ago he kind of reprimanded me. I felt like he only did that because I have that "nice" act and he felt like he could without consequences. And he is right because I still have the act, but inside now, he is on my enemy list. It is particularly hard to have to tolerate him, he almost has increased his contact with me to try to smooth things out, but really I hate him.

It sounds like you're overreacting a little. I don't know what happened exactly, but is it really necessary to put him on your "enemy list"? If he thinks you're friends, maybe he had a good reason, and reprimanding you was difficult for him. It might be worth it to let go of this hate and talk about it with him. Everyone you meet is bound to piss you off at some point. Will they all go on your list?

LonelySutton said:
Whenever anything is happening -- where I have to get ahead -- calling the train, I will literally push people out of the way to get their first. I do plot revenge against my enemys... even though I know it won't change anything.

I probably won't be able to talk you out of giving up all this hate, anger and selfishness through reason, so I'll try to appeal to your fear, if you have any: You're wrong about revenge, it will change things. It will get you into trouble. Someday you may push the wrong person to get ahead, and they'll push you in front of a train.

Is it really worth it for you to live this way? You don't have to help people, but all this "enemy list" and revenge talk makes it sound like you want to hurt others. You'll live with a huge list of enemies and no one around who will care if you're lonely, sick or depressed.

LonelySutton · Sep 3, 2014

Locke said:
You'll live with a huge list of enemies and no one around who will care if you're lonely, sick or depressed.

As if being nice does anything to have people around when you are lonely sick or depressed. No, reason can't appeal to me, because reason firmly supports being the bad guy. Look around... only the good die young. You can feel bad for me all you want, the fundamental thing is that I now see that being kind, being good, having good thoughts... doesn't do what common stories and literature says it does. I gain no joy from giving to charity when I know most times that is a waste of money. I gain no joy from being kind to someone and then having that person turn around and throw me or others under the bus. Giving to people and helping them out leads to no help at all when you need it. It typically leads to people taking advantage.

If you have ever seen X-men first class, it is the fundamental difference where professor x says to magneto -- killing your enemy won't bring you peace and magneto says, peace was never an option. My entire life view has changed and now I see the world so much differently than the good guys. There is no changing it. This is the way I see the world now. I can't "unsee" that.

Yesterday my boss, who has not been nice to me, went on vacation with his wife. He LOOOVVEES his wife. And I am frankly sure that without her... he will lose his mind. She broke her hip for the second time. She has now broken both hips before the age of 70. And she is currently in another country. Got to say, though I try to push it out of my head, I feel happy about it. Karma. Everyone says "how is she doing" and I say I don't know.. and they look at me and say - didn't you ask? Um, no. What does that have to do with me? I don't care. I care only that I am secretly happy. I suppose I only don't do the happy dance because I won't want Karma to spite me but... why shouldn't I feel a little joy?

People seem to think that somehow I should show kindness now that things are shifting ... so that he is getting older and needs support. I recoil at that. It is a variation on being the better person argument. I am the better person and he shouldn't get the benefit of being crappy to me (and others) and my world for years because he could and then, when he needs something, my support.

VanillaCreme · Sep 3, 2014

You're to be nice and kind to people because you know it's the better thing to do, and because it's how you'd want someone to treat you; Not because it'll get you somewhere with someone for something. You don't do amiable, considerate things because you conceive that you'll get the same in return. Not having an attitude of entitlement can go far in life lessons.

Locke · Sep 3, 2014

Locke said:
LonelySutton said:

No, reason can't appeal to me,

Click to expand...

You've made that evident. =/

I've talked to a lot of people who have been through hell in their lives. Most of them have gotten past it. They strive every day to improve their lives, help others, and be good people. They saw that the world was a dark place, and realized that it was up to them to bring light into it.

A few of them have taken their disappointments and used them as an excuse to hurt others to get what they want. The sad truth is that every one of them was too weak to keep the world from changing them. They embraced every negative human emotion at their disposal, because it was just easier for them to do the wrong thing. You are no different. The world isn't a better place because of people who choose to do the wrong thing, people like you.

LonelySutton said:

I can't "unsee" that.

Click to expand...

Yes you can. The way you see the world, and the way you react to it, is completely up to you. You're old enough so that you should know two things: 1. Treat others the way you want to be treated. 2. Don't take important life lessons from movies based on comic books. Magneto has been a "good guy" seemingly every other month in the comics, at least way back when I read them, lol. Is that really your best source on how to lead your life?

LonelySutton said:

As if being nice does anything to have people around when you are lonely sick or depressed.

Click to expand...

Being nice to people can make a huge difference. Knowing what kind of person you are now, I wouldn't want to be around you. I'm not saying that to be cruel, I'm being honest. Very few people want a "bad guy" in their life.

VanillaCreme said:

You're to be nice and kind to people because you know it's the better thing to do, and because it's how you'd want someone to treat you; Not because it'll get you somewhere with someone for something. You don't do amiable, considerate things because you conceive that you'll get the same in return. Not having an attitude of entitlement can go far in life lessons.

Click to expand...

And most importantly, what she said. If you're going to let entertainment tell you who you should be, go watch Sesame Street. Most of use learned what Vanilla said when we were 5 from watching it.

Anyway, I'm done. The thread will probably get closed if I go any further, and I actually don't want that. Maybe someone else can help you. I hope you see the light someday and decide to stop being a bad person.

Oh yeah, and if we're gonna quote superheroes:

"With great power comes great responsibility."

Lol, comics and philosophical debates about life don't mix. It's a little hard to take it seriously.

lonelydoc · Sep 5, 2014

I'm the bad guy because I think a great comeuppance awaits our unsustainable civilization, while most people out there are business "optimists" who think resources are infinite, we are going to become billionaires and live forever, and our children are going to become trillionaires and live longer than forever.

I try not to push the point too hard. People are unpredictable, you have to deal with them gently and don't tell them what to think or what to do, otherwise they lash out with rage at the messenger.

LonelySutton · Sep 5, 2014

lonelydoc said:
I try not to push the point too hard. People are unpredictable, you have to deal with them gently and don't tell them what to think or what to do, otherwise they lash out with rage at the messenger.

Yeh. I use the x-men as an illustration. Obviously I don't live my life by it. When you watch that movie you see that there is just no getting through to Xavier. He has his view and can't see the other person's. Ironically enough with the gift of telepathy. I think if you look at the movie... Magento isn't all bad. He is sure to say nice things about Mystique... sure to be encouraging... to those who don't look perfect, so he does have good quality and try to be good where he can... but he has a view of the world that is pragmatic and mean. And he is right.

If you don't have that view it can be crucial that you "turn" someone who does... because just maybe, you might start seeing their point.

stork_error · Sep 10, 2014

I don't have to post anything because sutton says everything I feel, so just ditto on all the sentiments, I feel ya and I get exactly what you are talking about. You are not wrong, psychology studies have proven it to be a fact.

So, I suppose one of two things is going to happen to us… either we will toughen up and learn how to be assertive or, we will go down with the ship from all the bitterness

It's not ok to be feeling what we feel, and Im sure we both know this, but again, you're not wrong, and trying to figure out how to deal with this reality is the real question because bitterness and anger is not the answer however… it suits me absolutely fine until i figure out what it is.

Ive suspected it might come down to assertiveness training at a cost of 345.00 per course but really, sadly right now that is a lot of money and interest on a visa, and i think i have enough debt already.

LonelySutton · Sep 11, 2014

stork_error said:
Ive suspected it might come down to assertiveness training at a cost of 345.00 per course but really, sadly right now that is a lot of money and interest on a visa, and i think i have enough debt already.

Ahhh I am assertive. Perhaps at the moment I am not but I started out that way. When I said, this isn't right, I only got looks and they did it anyway. When I said I won't work for this one, I got told I work or I am fired. Assertiveness only works if you are one of the chosen few who people want to be assertive. Your connected or good looking or somesuch. Otherwise, your just a crazy fool that needs "counseling".

stork_error · Sep 11, 2014

LonelySutton said:
stork_error said:

Ive suspected it might come down to assertiveness training at a cost of 345.00 per course but really, sadly right now that is a lot of money and interest on a visa, and i think i have enough debt already.

Click to expand...

Ahhh I am assertive. Perhaps at the moment I am not but I started out that way. When I said, this isn't right, I only got looks and they did it anyway. When I said I won't work for this one, I got told I work or I am fired. Assertiveness only works if you are one of the chosen few who people want to be assertive. Your connected or good looking or somesuch. Otherwise, your just a crazy fool that needs "counseling".

Yeah, youre probably right. My bad for forgetting reality.

Wayfarer · Sep 23, 2014

I must point out a thing. You don't have to be the good guy for the sake of others. Sure, you can if you want. To me the important thing is though, whether I can live with the choices I make.

Meaning I may be the "good guy", but if I am it's because it makes me feel like it's the right thing to do. Likewise one could be the "bad guy" if he believes in what he does.

As long as you can respect yourself for what you are and do, I guess what other people think is secondary.

Sorry if this seems a bit amoral but whatever...

ardour · Sep 23, 2014

"Good guys" need not turn the other cheek, love their enemies. That sounds like a straw man for your convenience.

Magneto - this is the best example of cold pragmatism you have?

EveWasFramed · Sep 23, 2014

ardour said:
"Good guys" need not turn the other cheek, love their enemies. That sounds like a straw man for your convenience.

Magneto - this is the best example of cold pragmatism you have?

I must agree. Not "turning the other cheek" doesn't necessarily make you a "bad" person.

TheSkaFish · Sep 23, 2014

Sometimes I think I too should take up the mantle of a bad guy. I've been good all my life, and so far all it's gotten me is passed over and spit on. It just makes people think you're boring, weak, or that they don't have to respect you because they know they can get away with it. Most people are smug piles of honeysuckle, the good ones are few and far between. The longer life goes on the more I am convinced it's a bad guy's world, and if you don't embrace that, you're just going to get blown out at everything. When it comes down to the crucial moments, all being good will do is ensure that you won't be potent enough to make things happen the way you want them to.

Last night I was trembling with anger so badly I couldn't sleep. Sometimes I no longer care about receiving love and affection. Sometimes all I want to do is hurt someone as badly as certain people have hurt me and then some, just for making me angry.

I look back and sometimes I seriously think I should have been a bully growing up, should have broken all the rules, should have gotten in fights, should have been mean to other people. You have to let them know where you stand in the pecking order. That's who gets confidence early, and that's everything. You get a massive head start. Life is a competition and if you don't think so, you're just kidding yourself.

But I still have problems being a bad guy. Not only have I been raised to be good, but also, to me a lot of bad is just stupid. All risk, little return. Like stealing. To me, I don't get it. It carries a high chance of being caught, and if it doesn't, whatever it is is probably of so little value that the risk greatly outweighs any benefits from having it. Might as well just do things the good way, being bad just never seems worth the stress.

EveWasFramed · Sep 23, 2014

I'm the bad guy

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