Why can’t I get along with women?

[ardour]

Disclaimer; a lot of members who are familiar with me aren't likely to have much patience for this; please pass if you’ve heard enough whining on the topic…

So up until recently I was getting along well enough with the new person in this office. Last Friday after work I asked her about her boyfriend (a 31 year old Math lecturer) and a few other things and she seemed really eager to talk, we had this long conversation. On Monday she asked about my Weekend right in the middle of work hours. The next couple of days things were rather cooler, no hello's or goodbyes, kind of weird but as we're concentrating on work I thought nothing of it. No one smiles or acts friendly all the time. But this morning when we got up to leave for a last training session, she looks straight at me, face drops, and rushes off ahead like she’s trying to avoid walking with me. Upon reaching the next building she took the stairs instead of the lift, I can only assume because she didn't want to take the same lift as me. So obnoxious.

Why bother starting a thread about this... why should this matter. Well variations of this story have happened many times over the last few years, my whole life really – I get along with a female acquaintance for a time, then suddenly and without warning it ends and I'm left thinking there’s something seriously wrong with the way I interact with women. Literally like my body language and expressions produce a visceral dislike. I've not grown resigned to it yet, even at 35, if anything it hits harder each time as further re-enforcement for self-loathing. Never assaulted or harassed women yet I feel like that sort of person now. It’s even affecting sleep and the ability to concentrate on coursework. There's a long assignment to write this weekend but so far all I can think about is this morning.

There are anxiety problems. Extreme awkwardness. When it gets particularly bad I'm inclined to either seek validation to feel better or shy away from socializing. This usually means being too eager to talk, often semi-coherently when there's little to say, or cold and avoidant. It's a problem and women are so much more sensitive, so intuitively attuned to anything ‘not right’ about a person.

There are no problems with other guys however, they don't care if I'm anxious at times, it doesn't matter to them. But women do not react well so I'm thinking of limiting all friendships around work to men just for sanity's sake. The women I consistently get along with are those 10+ years my senior like middle-aged colleagues, and an Aunt.

Will another topic really help? No, it's merely here to vent

I would be interesting if the more understanding women on this forum could have a Skype conversation with me and point out what’s “wrong”, because I’ve absolutely had it. Edit; not sure if that's actually a good idea.

 

[jaguarundi]

Ask her. Tell her that you feel you have a problem with women sometimes, you don't know what it is and you want to find out. Ask her to be honest, and tell you straight out what the problem is, if there is one.

It's the only way you are ever going to know, IMO.

Rip the bandaid off, and do it. You need to let the air get to this, and stop letting it fester.

 

[ardour]

Ask her. Tell her that you feel you have a problem with women sometimes, you don't know what it is and you want to find out. Ask her to be honest, and tell you straight out what the problem is, if there is one.

It's the only way you are ever going to know, IMO.

Rip the bandaid off, and do it. You need to let the air get to this, and stop letting it fester.

I did (sort of,) two weeks ago. I mentioned the fact about anxiety, how it can affect me, and not to take it personally. Tried to say it as casually as possible. She laughed it off and said she hadn't noticed. I can't say that stuff again.

 

[daddymack]

Ask her. Tell her that you feel you have a problem with women sometimes, you don't know what it is and you want to find out. Ask her to be honest, and tell you straight out what the problem is, if there is one.

It's the only way you are ever going to know, IMO.

Rip the bandaid off, and do it. You need to let the air get to this, and stop letting it fester.

I did - two weeks ago. I mentioned the fact about anxiety, how it affects me, and not to take it personally. Tried to say it as casually as possible. She laughed it off and said she hadn't noticed. I can't say that stuff again.

you cant blame your anxiety... dont ever ever tell a girl that, never put your self down you have to be proud of who you before you want someone to accept you

 

[jaguarundi]

Ask her. Tell her that you feel you have a problem with women sometimes, you don't know what it is and you want to find out. Ask her to be honest, and tell you straight out what the problem is, if there is one.

It's the only way you are ever going to know, IMO.

Rip the bandaid off, and do it. You need to let the air get to this, and stop letting it fester.

I did (sort of,) two weeks ago. I mentioned the fact about anxiety, how it can affect me, and not to take it personally. Tried to say it as casually as possible. She laughed it off and said she hadn't noticed. I can't say that stuff again.

No you didn't ask her. You told her what you thought the problem was.

Maybe anxiety is at the bottom of it, maybe you just gabble on and bore the women to death so that they want to avoid you. Maybe all you do is talk about you and never seem as if you are listening.

Maybe its all in your head. Maybe you have two heads, or one that is green.

Its all absolute speculation unless you find someone in real life who will actually tell you. If not a woman then maybe another bloke who has seen you talking to women. A bloke who does get along with women (and I don't mean just romantically).[/i]

 

[ardour]

No you didn't ask her. You told her what you thought the problem was.

Maybe anxiety is at the bottom of it, maybe you just gabble on and bore the women to death so that they want to avoid you. Maybe all you do is talk about you and never seem as if you are listening.

Maybe its all in your head. Maybe you have two heads, or one that is green.

Its all absolute speculation unless you find someone in real life who will actually tell you. If not a woman then maybe another bloke who has seen you talking to women. A bloke who does get along with women (and I don't mean just romantically).[/i]

With regards to boring people, maybe you're taking that from my posts. She actually did most of the talking once the conversation got started. Perhaps I am tiresome though.

From what I gather I always look angry or aggressive unless I'm making an effort not to. I'll try to say hello and smile but it sounds wrong and looks more like a grimace, and this is after talking to the same person without any problems the previous day. I can't explain it. Being ugly doesn't help. A more tolerant female friend- my only one at the moment - put it bluntly; we wouldn't be friends if it weren't for the fact that someone told her to give me another chance, because of the way I happened to have spoken to her at first. So it might be to do with not being relaxed and natural.

 

[jaguarundi]

No you didn't ask her. You told her what you thought the problem was.

Maybe anxiety is at the bottom of it, maybe you just gabble on and bore the women to death so that they want to avoid you. Maybe all you do is talk about you and never seem as if you are listening.

Maybe its all in your head. Maybe you have two heads, or one that is green.

Its all absolute speculation unless you find someone in real life who will actually tell you. If not a woman then maybe another bloke who has seen you talking to women. A bloke who does get along with women (and I don't mean just romantically).[/i]

With regards to boring people, maybe you're taking that from my posts. She actually did most of the talking once the conversation got started. Perhaps I am tiresome though.

From what I gather I always look angry or aggressive unless I'm making an effort not to. I'll try to say hello and smile but it sounds wrong and looks more like a grimace, and this is after talking to the same person without any problems the previous day. I can't explain it. Being ugly doesn't help. A more tolerant female friend- my only one at the moment - put it bluntly; we wouldn't be friends if it weren't for the fact that someone told her to give me another chance, because of the way I happened to have spoken to her at first. So it might be to do with not being relaxed and natural.

No, babes, I don't think you are boring. I don't think you are not boring, either. The point I was trying to make is that I have NO IDEA what the problem is, and nor, really do you. Or even if you really have got one that is as bad as you seem to think it is.

You are mind-reading these women based upon your view of yourself. What they see, and think of what they see, you can only find out if they tell you.

I would need to get actual, concrete feedback to really verify what is going on. Everything else is speculation. Hmm?

 

[Littlesecret]

I don't know you but I doubt there is anything wrong with you, self aware people are so conscious of what they say I very much doubt you have the ability to repel people.

I personally think it could be one of two things, you are so self aware of your actions you come across wooden and maybe unnatural which can make some people feel slightly uneasy, so I would suggest relaxing (I know it's easy to say) but try and give it a go?

Second, could be your attracted to talking to self-absorbed women, that are only really happy talking about themselves and once you start talking about you they are no longer interested.

I could be completely wrong with my theories but from what you have written, that's what comes to mind lol

 

[raincloud]

I was curious to read this thread because I am a woman and I just don't get along with men. AT ALL. There are a few whose company I enjoy, but that is because they treat me like I am human. Most men don't do that. The truth is, most men don't give me the time of day because they don't find me sexually attractive. There are some who think of me as "one of the guys" and for this reason, and they are the nicest, but usually they end up doing or saying horrible things because they don't think of me as female (I am talking about straight men, mostly). Are you possibly only talking about women you put on a pedestal?

 

[Triple Bogey]

Disclaimer; a lot of members who are familiar with me aren't likely to have much patience for this; please pass if you’ve heard enough whining on the topic…

So up until recently I was getting along well enough with the new person in this office. Last Friday after work I asked her about her boyfriend (a 31 year old Math lecturer) and a few other things and she seemed really eager to talk, we had this long conversation. On Monday she asked about my Weekend right in the middle of work hours. The next couple of days things were rather cooler, no hello's or goodbyes, kind of weird but as we're concentrating on work I thought nothing of it. No one smiles or acts friendly all the time. But this morning when we got up to leave for a last training session, she looks straight at me, face drops, and rushes off ahead like she’s trying to avoid walking with me. Upon reaching the next building she took the stairs instead of the lift, I can only assume because she didn't want to take the same lift as me. So obnoxious.

Why bother starting a thread about this... why should this matter. Well variations of this story have happened many times over the last few years, my whole life really – I get along with a female acquaintance for a time, then suddenly and without warning it ends and I'm left thinking there’s something seriously wrong with the way I interact with women. Literally like my body language and expressions produce a visceral dislike. I've not grown resigned to it yet, even at 35, if anything it hits harder each time as further re-enforcement for self-loathing. Never assaulted or harassed women yet I feel like that sort of person now. It’s even affecting sleep and the ability to concentrate on coursework. There's a long assignment to write this weekend but so far all I can think about is this morning.

There are anxiety problems. Extreme awkwardness. When it gets particularly bad I'm inclined to either seek validation to feel better or shy away from socializing. This usually means being too eager to talk, often semi-coherently when there's little to say, or cold and avoidant. It's a problem and women are so much more sensitive, so intuitively attuned to anything ‘not right’ about a person.

There are no problems with other guys however, they don't care if I'm anxious at times, it doesn't matter to them. But women do not react well so I'm thinking of limiting all friendships around work to men just for sanity's sake. The women I consistently get along with are those 10+ years my senior like middle-aged colleagues, and an Aunt.

Will another topic really help? No, it's merely here to vent

I would be interesting if the more understanding women on this forum could have a Skype conversation with me and point out what’s “wrong”, because I’ve absolutely had it. Edit; not sure if that's actually a good idea.

One point - I wouldn't ask a woman about their boyfriend. I work with loads of women and I never ever do that. I couldn't give a honeysuckle to be honest, I have no interest in that sort of thing and it may be too personal. I've known some women for over 10 years and they talk to me occasionally about who they are seeing, I nod my head but honestly I couldn't give a toss.

I think possibly the other people / women in the office are telling stories about you to the new starters. That's why they seem happy to talk to you at first and then it dies a death. Another thing could be, at first new starters are happy to talk to anybody, they want to fit in. That dies away though after time.

This lass who started a few months ago. The first time I worked with her, we never stopped talking to each other. I thought she was very friendly. However the second time she didn't talk at all, didn't even reply to my 'hello'. And then after that I gave up and ignored her. She left and I never said goodbye. I didn't wonder though what happened. Did one of the others say something ? I didn't spend one second thinking about it because I couldn't care less. Her loss. It happens.

I wouldn't worry about it. As long as some people talk to you then your not a total outcast. Anybody who isn't friendly towards you, it's their choice. Don't worry about it. I bet there is nothing wrong with you or how you talk to people.

 

[ardour]

Thanks Triple Bogey, that makes me feel better about the situation.

Are you possibly only talking about women you put on a pedestal?

It's not been exclusive to women I've found attractive, but it's that much worse when it is. Not sure if that's because I care more about their judgements, or just feeling more nervous around them.

 

[Batman55]

I would be interesting if the more understanding women on this forum could have a Skype conversation with me and point out what’s “wrong”, because I’ve absolutely had it. Edit; not sure if that's actually a good idea.

I really do think this is a good idea. Some things cannot be understood by text alone, IMO.

 

[ardour]

never mind

 

[1andonly1]

Ask her. Tell her that you feel you have a problem with women sometimes, you don't know what it is and you want to find out. Ask her to be honest, and tell you straight out what the problem is, if there is one.

It's the only way you are ever going to know, IMO.

Rip the bandaid off, and do it. You need to let the air get to this, and stop letting it fester.

I did - two weeks ago. I mentioned the fact about anxiety, how it affects me, and not to take it personally. Tried to say it as casually as possible. She laughed it off and said she hadn't noticed. I can't say that stuff again.

you cant blame your anxiety... dont ever ever tell a girl that, never put your self down you have to be proud of who you before you want someone to accept you

That is so true, but so hard to do if you've been mentally trained (so to speak, growing up with incessant, constant negativity around you).

 

[Triple Bogey]

Disclaimer; a lot of members who are familiar with me aren't likely to have much patience for this; please pass if you’ve heard enough whining on the topic…

So up until recently I was getting along well enough with the new person in this office. Last Friday after work I asked her about her boyfriend (a 31 year old Math lecturer) and a few other things and she seemed really eager to talk, we had this long conversation. On Monday she asked about my Weekend right in the middle of work hours. The next couple of days things were rather cooler, no hello's or goodbyes, kind of weird but as we're concentrating on work I thought nothing of it. No one smiles or acts friendly all the time. But this morning when we got up to leave for a last training session, she looks straight at me, face drops, and rushes off ahead like she’s trying to avoid walking with me. Upon reaching the next building she took the stairs instead of the lift, I can only assume because she didn't want to take the same lift as me. So obnoxious.

Why bother starting a thread about this... why should this matter. Well variations of this story have happened many times over the last few years, my whole life really – I get along with a female acquaintance for a time, then suddenly and without warning it ends and I'm left thinking there’s something seriously wrong with the way I interact with women. Literally like my body language and expressions produce a visceral dislike. I've not grown resigned to it yet, even at 35, if anything it hits harder each time as further re-enforcement for self-loathing. Never assaulted or harassed women yet I feel like that sort of person now. It’s even affecting sleep and the ability to concentrate on coursework. There's a long assignment to write this weekend but so far all I can think about is this morning.

There are anxiety problems. Extreme awkwardness. When it gets particularly bad I'm inclined to either seek validation to feel better or shy away from socializing. This usually means being too eager to talk, often semi-coherently when there's little to say, or cold and avoidant. It's a problem and women are so much more sensitive, so intuitively attuned to anything ‘not right’ about a person.

There are no problems with other guys however, they don't care if I'm anxious at times, it doesn't matter to them. But women do not react well so I'm thinking of limiting all friendships around work to men just for sanity's sake. The women I consistently get along with are those 10+ years my senior like middle-aged colleagues, and an Aunt.

Will another topic really help? No, it's merely here to vent

I would be interesting if the more understanding women on this forum could have a Skype conversation with me and point out what’s “wrong”, because I’ve absolutely had it. Edit; not sure if that's actually a good idea.

it's not a good idea. It will just make you more self conscious and depressed if the feedback isn't very good.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

I generally end friendships if I feel attraction, because it has always just gotten in the way. I never have been able to have a successful friendship if I want more, because she never wants to take that step.

Not sure if you are experiencing the same thing, or not.

 

[ardour]

Things have gone more pear shaped. Just before I posted this I also sent a short e-mail to her basically apologizing if there had been some misunderstanding.
An idiotic move. I tried to recall the email over the weekend but it failed.

Today she asked to speak to me - said that as far as she was concerned there was no problem and if I had an actual problem to speak to the managers. That's the kind of response someone comes up with if they think you might be harassing them.

So the attempt to get an explanation for the sudden change results in a situation where a coworker thinks of me in these terms. I doubt we'll speak again unless it's work-related.

Jag, in regard to your advice, had I asked what you suggested I think it would have likely resulted in a similar outcome. Sometimes being open and upfront isn't the answer.

 

[jaguarundi]

Mind reading yet again. No good ever comes of it.

That is also the kind of response someone gives when there hasn't been a problem and someone is mystified and embarrassed by getting an email suggesting that there has been.

If you had been straight with her, up front and asked face to face if there was a problem, and if so,what it was, this would not have happened.

You have no idea what people are thinking about you, and your tendency to imagine that you do know, and that it's bad, is what is causing you these problems.

 

[ardour]

Mind reading yet again. No good ever comes of it.

That is also the kind of response someone gives when there hasn't been a problem and someone is mystified and embarrassed by getting an email suggesting that there has been.

Had she casually said "oh there's no problem" it would have been okay, but the tone and reference to management suggests otherwise.

If you had been straight with her, up front and asked face to face if there was a problem, and if so,what it was, this would not have happened.

I don't see how putting her on the spot in person (again) would have resulted in a more positive outcome. Anyway I certainly won't be doing that now.

 

[Triple Bogey]

Things have gone more pear shaped. Just before I posted this I also sent a short e-mail to her basically apologizing if there had been some misunderstanding.
An idiotic move. I tried to recall the email over the weekend but it failed.

Today she asked to speak to me - said that as far as she was concerned there was no problem and if I had an actual problem to speak to the managers. That's the kind of response someone comes up with if they think you might be harassing them.

So the attempt to get an explanation for the sudden change results in a situation where a coworker thinks of me in these terms. I doubt we'll speak again unless it's work-related.

Jag, in regards to your advice, had I asked what you suggested I think it would have likely resulted in a similar outcome. Sometimes being open and upfront isn't the answer.

I think the mistake was you apologizing. You had nothing to say 'sorry' about.

I have had loads of disputes at work, a lot of them with women. Usually I say something off hand to somebody, that somebody goes and tells a twisted version of it to that person and they are ******* livid at me. I can see it when I work with them next or they leave a message of facebook. What I do is keep my head down, only talk to them if I have to, never let it look like it bothers me, never EVER ask them whats up. And then 2 weeks later I just start talking to them as normal pretending nothing as been wrong. Almost every person will chat back, they all look happy about it. And things get to normal. I don't ever discuss the problem unless they bring it up and then I will explain what I did say and say 'sorry'.