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My enemy is myself
#11
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I think this is easier said than done.
Definitely. The thing about that is if you always say "it's too hard" and never try then you are the only one holding yourself back from living a happy life.
When I realized this, you know what I did? I started taking leaps of faith into things and I was all the more happier.
It's a repeating cycle. If you believe its too hard you will never try, and if you never try you will always believe its too hard. So the only way out of that cycle is to have the strength to break it.

(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: And what are the consequences of being rejected? You get humiliated and laughed at.
And so what!? Maybe you'll get upset for a while, but you know what? You'll get over it and you'll move on with your life.
Do you think anyone would ever get anything done if they were always too scared about getting humiliated or laughed at to actually try? Again the only thing stopping you is this cycle.

You can't hold yourself back from trying something because of rejection or momentary consequences. There are consequences to everything. Even walking takes effort. Should we never walk again if we stumble? If so then no child would ever learn to walk at all! We learn from these sort of mistakes. It is how we grow. Take rejection as an opportunity to grow as a person. Don't let it make you afraid to even try.

(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I've heard this from other people too. My question always is why doesn't someone -anyone- come up and talk to me? Why do I always have to do it first?

I realize I want to be around people so much but at the same time I am trusting them less and less.
The answer is very simple - Almost everyone is scared. Very few people have found strength. And those with real strength only have time for so much. They can't help everyone.
So it is rather rare for anyone to step outside of their comfort zone and actually do something 'different'. That is why you never see it - it is why almost no one ever sees it.

This is why arrogance, egotism, and big-headedness often gets girls (or men) and money. It provides the illusion of strength and for scared people this is everything. It is comfort and safety. But even these arrogant egotists are scared. Internally they are often even more scared than anyone else. The narcissism is in fact the only way they know how to deal with that insecurity, that fear.
But that is an illusion - and once the illusion disappears so do the relationships, and often so does the money.
You don't just see this on the individual level - this psychology is the very root of evil. The very basis for things like Hitler coming to power. All historical travesties come down to the illusions of strength and general fear and anxiety of the population.

Real strength garners true, lasting relationships. Ones that stand against all difficulty and against all time.
These are the sort of relationships everyone wants but the ones almost everyone have such difficulty finding.

You want the 'secret to life'? The secret to happiness? Be the one with the strength. Take chances and always be a good person. That's my advice.
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#12
(03-19-2015, 05:12 AM)BeyondShy Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 04:47 AM)Mouse Wrote: It's all out there, you know. But you have get off your arse and do something about your loneliness.

Anna Mouse

Honestly, who can argue with advice like this? It is just so hard making that first step.

Except you have to take that first step. Until you do, you won't know.

It's springtime and little birds will have to soon fly their nest. At first, they teeter on the branch. And then in faith they spread their wings - and fly.

I am reminded of the French poet Guillaume Apollinaire, who wrote:

“Come to the edge," he said.
"We can't, we're afraid!" they responded.
"Come to the edge," he said.
"We can't, We will fall!" they responded.
"Come to the edge," he said.
And so they came.
And he pushed them.
And they flew.”
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#13
(03-19-2015, 05:27 AM)TheRealCallie Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I know already that none of those seven women will pay any attention to me. I'll bet my house on it.
You do NOT know that. Stop thinking that way, it's what gets you in trouble with yourself.

It's worse now. Ten people are going and three of them are men. I honestly can picture what's going to happen. And then they'll act all surprised when I never want to come to another meeting.

(03-19-2015, 05:27 AM)TheRealCallie Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I've heard this from other people too. My question always is why doesn't someone -anyone- come up and talk to me? Why do I always have to do it first?

It could be because you subconsciously put out an unapproachable aura. You don't like yourself and already "know" people won't talk to you, so why should they? They likely see what you try to hide.
Be more confident, put out a little effort, definitely be more positive and you may find it changes.

Well, that does makes sense. Ok. How would you go about doing it?

RainbowWalker Wrote:The most basic rule to change something is: You have to learn to love yourself. You can start thinking about loving others as soon as you have started to finally love yourself as well.
One thing requires the other. It's as simple as that.

What a hard thing to do. Hell, I don't even accept myself.

RainbowWalker Wrote:The second thing is that you should not give other people this huge power over you. Because this is what you do. As soon as anyone can make you feel that bad, it shows that you're giving these people more power over you as you should. It's another thing we often don't realize.

Well, I agree with that. None of these damn people that I have come across yet deserved to have this power over me. I actually resent them for it.

RainbowWalker Wrote:As soon as you start learning to accept yourself (and eventually to even "love" yourself) you will see that your fear of rejection will gradually become less. Because as long as you almost hate yourself like that and as long as you are so afraid of rejection, you will get rejection.

It's because people can notice it. You radiate this fear and others can sense it easily. I was told the very same thing many years ago already too. So I learned about this the hard way too.

Again, something I can't argue about.

But give me a minute here. If people can sense that I am nervous in these situations why wouldn't they try to meet me halfway? If they can tell this why not bother giving me a chance? I am not asking for a handout here. Just a hand from these people. I don't even get that.

(03-19-2015, 06:06 AM)Despicable Me Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I think this is easier said than done.
Definitely. The thing about that is if you always say "it's too hard" and never try then you are the only one holding yourself back from living a happy life.
When I realized this, you know what I did? I started taking leaps of faith into things and I was all the more happier.
It's a repeating cycle. If you believe its too hard you will never try, and if you never try you will always believe its too hard. So the only way out of that cycle is to have the strength to break it.

You probably had someone to help you take that first step.



(03-19-2015, 06:06 AM)Despicable Me Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I've heard this from other people too. My question always is why doesn't someone -anyone- come up and talk to me? Why do I always have to do it first?

I realize I want to be around people so much but at the same time I am trusting them less and less.
The answer is very simple - Almost everyone is scared. Very few people have found strength. And those with real strength only have time for so much. They can't help everyone.
So it is rather rare for anyone to step outside of their comfort zone and actually do something 'different'. That is why you never see it - it is why almost no one ever sees it.

My comfort zone is inside my house. I don't know where else to go.

And as far as anyone stepping outside of their comfort zone I personally have never seen it. I don't think anyone really cares.



And before I post this I just want to say that everyone who has responded in this thread has really had a lot of insightful things to say. I got a lot to think about.
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#14
(03-19-2015, 06:42 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: You probably had someone to help you take that first step.
You and I are different people. Whether I did or did not is irrelevant.
Making excuses for yourself is only repeating the cycle.

If you want to know 'my story'. No, not really. I realized the cycle I was in and simply just started taking steps to get out of it. I chose bigger and bigger steps until I could finally escape it.
I had people to help me along the way but the first steps I took were entirely my own. You could say that, in a way, I 'earned' those people's help. I met my wife along that path, and she was obviously a huge change in my life and did a lot to help me to realize myself, but was she what set me on that path? I'd say no.

Though I will point out, I did have people giving me advice like I am giving you now, if that counts as 'help'. I'm sure it took me quite a while before I ever really realized what they were trying to say. More people than I can even remember tried to explain this to me. I don't expect you to remember me either. That's okay.

(03-19-2015, 06:42 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: My comfort zone is inside my house. I don't know where else to go.

And as far as anyone stepping outside of their comfort zone I personally have never seen it. I don't think anyone really cares.
Your real comfort zone is your worries and your anxiety. The place you go to hide to get away from the consequences of taking real action to change something in your life. It is a mental comfort zone.

Your house is just your physical comfort zone. Getting away from it is sometimes people's first step.
For example, A lot of people who go to college experience the new freedom of 'change', from the breaking away of their physical comfort, and so they begin to finally socialize only once they go to college. The change is symbollic of their change into adulthood. It is the catalyst that helps them to realize that the cycle can be broken.

But it can be anything really. Asking a girl out or for her phone number. Just talking to someone in class. Walking to somewhere you've never been before. Spending some time outside in places you don't normally go. Dyeing your hair. Getting a piercing or tattoo. Buying (and wearing) new clothes that you have never had the guts to buy/wear before. Etc. Etc.
There are so many ways to step outside of your comfort zone and start breaking away from that cycle. So many ways to build strength and character. So many ways to find yourself, and each way is unique to the individual.

Again, if you want to know my story, I did several of the things above before I ever met my wife, before I had any friends, and before I ever asked my parents for any help. It was just me becoming 'me'. I just got tired of that cycle. I chose to break it.

Anything that breaks you away from the 'normal' stuff you do every day is a step towards breaking that cycle.

Like I said - It's a leap of faith. Very few people are able to make that leap. It's why you've never seen it. It isn't because they don't care, it is because they are afraid.
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#15
(03-19-2015, 07:20 AM)Despicable Me Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 06:42 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: My comfort zone is inside my house. I don't know where else to go.
Your real comfort zone is your worries and your anxiety. The place you go to hide to get away from the consequences of taking real action to change something in your life. It is a mental comfort zone.

Your house is just your physical comfort zone. Getting away from it is sometimes people's first step.

Wow. That is so true. I feel most comfortable in my own home. It's not that I am afraid to leave my house or anything like that. I mean I can do that at a moment's notice. It's just that I don't. Not counting the supermarket I don't go anywhere else.


(03-19-2015, 07:20 AM)Despicable Me Wrote: Like I said - It's a leap of faith. Very few people are able to make that leap. It's why you've never seen it. It isn't because they don't care, it is because they are afraid.

I guess that explains why I never saw it.
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#16
A lot of people (possibly most?) feel most comfortable in their homes (it is the place where you spend most of your time), but this only becomes a problem when you entirely depend on that comfort zone and don't know how to break away from it. If the only place you go is the supermarket you probably need to branch out a little.

To be honest I think the very first step I took was actually just going to a real salon/barber to get my hair cut instead of having a relative do it. Then I started to do things like sign up for school clubs and such. Then started to actually chat with people at school, eventually going to the mall and movies with them. Even over to their houses, which was extremely uncomfortable for me because I did not really ever go to other people's houses, ever. I didn't know what was 'okay' and what wasn't, at all. I also got a piercing in there somewhere, and probably did a couple other things to get attention.
I even, sort of, went on a date with a girl. (Who rejected me after that 'date', and never once let me call her my 'girlfriend', but oh well...)

Know something really funny? Apparently all along there were several girls who actually liked me. A few times a girl even flirted with me, but I'd never know any of this until long after I was out of school, when I didn't see them anymore. (But I met my wife who I was dating at the time, so it was okay.) All along they were also just too afraid to say anything to me, too. Even the ones who flirted were too afraid to ask me on a date, hoping that I'd be the one to ask them.

For me, the extremely shy guy who pretty much never said a word to other people, the guy some people picked on because he was 'too smart' and 'too nerdy' and 'too quiet' (and eventually 'too weird') and stuff like that, I was in way over my head - and loved every minute of it.
And all it took was to take a few chances. To get away from my comfort zones for a while.
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#17
(03-20-2015, 02:33 AM)Despicable Me Wrote: And all it took was to take a few chances. To get away from my comfort zones for a while.

I enjoy reading about your success stories. It makes me happy to see that someone actually made something of themselves.

I sure am not. Today just proved it. Here's what I mean.

A few weeks ago I had to get a tooth pulled and in the evening I went to to supermarket to get some stuff and while I was there I got some coffee. My jaw was still pretty sore and I was unable to talk clearly when I gave my order and I apologized to the girl there for that.

She said it was no problem and was extremely kind to me and I was grateful for that. She even shook my hand and hoped that I would get well soon.

I went home that day wondering to myself that maybe this girl had some interest in me. Maybe I said. Or maybe she was just being nice to a customer.

Well these past couple weeks when I was there she wasn't working but today she was. I ordered coffee and she remembered me from two weeks ago and asked how my tooth was. (A good sign I said to myself.)

While she was getting my coffee I was going over in my head all the priceless words of advice I received since I have been here. I said to myself that they are just only going to be words that I read somewhere unless I use that advice in the way it was intended. So, I did.

Mr. Cool I am not. I live on the other side of town from Mr. Cool. I started asking her if she liked coffee herself. She said no because it gave her heartburn.

We now interrupt this hilarious story to tell the reader to prepare to see how our hero shoots himself in the foot yet again. Read on. It's funny. Tell your friends.

As I said I was thinking of her these past few weeks and I kept on going over possible scenarios of me rising to the occasion and saying something witty and funny and asking her to go out for coffee with me sometime.

I did just that. I asked her if she would like to go out for coffee sometime even though I just heard that the stuff gives her heartburn.

She said no. That one word almost knocked me to the ground. Actually she said "no, that's ok" while having a forced smile on her face and I could swear that if she wasn't working at the time she would have turned around and ran.

As soon as I heard the word no time almost stopped and the pain I had from the hernia surgery I had back in 2009 immediately returned. I apologized to her twice and then I walked away.

I walked around the supermarket for a couple of minutes. I didn't even know what I bought and returned home.

Driving home one thought kept on going through my mind over and over. I never should have said a word.
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#18
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote:
(03-18-2015, 10:52 PM)TheRealCallie Wrote: You can conquer your shyness, but it will take hard work and putting yourself out of your comfort zone. Try something harder than you usually do, say hi to people, that sort of thing, and it will get easier the more you do it.


What a hard thing to do.

You know, it's been a long time that someone has come up to me to say hi. I do notice that if I can get comfortable (it does happen) I can hold up a conversation as well as anyone but that first step is like trying to jump out of a plane for the very first time.

Last September I had to go to a fiftieth anniversary party. Got all dressed up, suit and tie, etc. I sat at a table with seven other people and even though I smiled and laughed at some of the things that they were saying (even if they weren't that funny) they never talked to me. As the evening wore on I smiled and laughed a lot less and when it was time for me to leave I was furious but I didn't show it. I was like everyone else there but they didn't include me and I don't know why.

This is a hard situation for you. I went thru loads of nights like this. It's the reason I don't socialize.


(03-18-2015, 10:52 PM)TheRealCallie Wrote: These people that insult and/or embarrass you, do they KNOW you?

Some of them know me. They think they are just "joking around."

(03-18-2015, 10:52 PM)TheRealCallie Wrote: What people say about you can't harm you unless you allow it to. Instead of focusing on the insults and what see see wrong with yourself, look for the good, focus on that. Go a week or even a day without judging yourself and see what happens.

I can only try but right now I am already worried about something that is supposed to go down on Sunday.

I am trying to do steps to help me along with this serious problem of mine so I decided to join a anxiety group that is going to meet this Sunday. So far nine people will be in attendance. Seven women and two men. I know already that none of those seven women will pay any attention to me. I'll bet my house on it.

(03-19-2015, 01:30 AM)Despicable Me Wrote: The problem isn't that you're "shy" it is that you have incredibly low self esteem. The solution to it is very simple, you just need to stop worrying about what everyone else thinks and just be yourself. Learn to take chances. Learn to open up. Learn to worry less and act more.
What are really the consequences to being rejected? Rejection is a part of life and the sooner you realize and accept this the sooner you will learn to overcome it and be happy.

I think this is easier said than done.

And what are the consequences of being rejected? You get humiliated and laughed at.



(03-19-2015, 01:30 AM)Despicable Me Wrote: What you should realize is that a lot of the people you know probably feel exactly the same way as you, and that they are also waiting for someone to walk up and just talk to them. Waiting for someone to come and get to know them. If I had realized that back in middle school or even high school I'm sure things would have went completely different for me. All you need to do is realize this, too. Even the people who might look like they already have some friends might have really low self esteem and unable to really talk to anyone else. It's all about perspective. Yours is wrong.

I've heard this from other people too. My question always is why doesn't someone -anyone- come up and talk to me? Why do I always have to do it first?

I realize I want to be around people so much but at the same time I am trusting them less and less.

(03-19-2015, 06:42 AM)BeyondShy Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 05:27 AM)TheRealCallie Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I know already that none of those seven women will pay any attention to me. I'll bet my house on it.
You do NOT know that. Stop thinking that way, it's what gets you in trouble with yourself.

It's worse now. Ten people are going and three of them are men. I honestly can picture what's going to happen. And then they'll act all surprised when I never want to come to another meeting.

(03-19-2015, 05:27 AM)TheRealCallie Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I've heard this from other people too. My question always is why doesn't someone -anyone- come up and talk to me? Why do I always have to do it first?

It could be because you subconsciously put out an unapproachable aura. You don't like yourself and already "know" people won't talk to you, so why should they? They likely see what you try to hide.
Be more confident, put out a little effort, definitely be more positive and you may find it changes.

Well, that does makes sense. Ok. How would you go about doing it?

RainbowWalker Wrote:The most basic rule to change something is: You have to learn to love yourself. You can start thinking about loving others as soon as you have started to finally love yourself as well.
One thing requires the other. It's as simple as that.

What a hard thing to do. Hell, I don't even accept myself.

RainbowWalker Wrote:The second thing is that you should not give other people this huge power over you. Because this is what you do. As soon as anyone can make you feel that bad, it shows that you're giving these people more power over you as you should. It's another thing we often don't realize.

Well, I agree with that. None of these damn people that I have come across yet deserved to have this power over me. I actually resent them for it.

RainbowWalker Wrote:As soon as you start learning to accept yourself (and eventually to even "love" yourself) you will see that your fear of rejection will gradually become less. Because as long as you almost hate yourself like that and as long as you are so afraid of rejection, you will get rejection.

It's because people can notice it. You radiate this fear and others can sense it easily. I was told the very same thing many years ago already too. So I learned about this the hard way too.

Again, something I can't argue about.

But give me a minute here. If people can sense that I am nervous in these situations why wouldn't they try to meet me halfway? If they can tell this why not bother giving me a chance? I am not asking for a handout here. Just a hand from these people. I don't even get that.

(03-19-2015, 06:06 AM)Despicable Me Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I think this is easier said than done.
Definitely. The thing about that is if you always say "it's too hard" and never try then you are the only one holding yourself back from living a happy life.
When I realized this, you know what I did? I started taking leaps of faith into things and I was all the more happier.
It's a repeating cycle. If you believe its too hard you will never try, and if you never try you will always believe its too hard. So the only way out of that cycle is to have the strength to break it.

You probably had someone to help you take that first step.



(03-19-2015, 06:06 AM)Despicable Me Wrote:
(03-19-2015, 03:02 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I've heard this from other people too. My question always is why doesn't someone -anyone- come up and talk to me? Why do I always have to do it first?

I realize I want to be around people so much but at the same time I am trusting them less and less.
The answer is very simple - Almost everyone is scared. Very few people have found strength. And those with real strength only have time for so much. They can't help everyone.
So it is rather rare for anyone to step outside of their comfort zone and actually do something 'different'. That is why you never see it - it is why almost no one ever sees it.

My comfort zone is inside my house. I don't know where else to go.

And as far as anyone stepping outside of their comfort zone I personally have never seen it. I don't think anyone really cares.



And before I post this I just want to say that everyone who has responded in this thread has really had a lot of insightful things to say. I got a lot to think about.

I was like you 20 years ago, everything the same. The nights out you describe; I used to stand by myself all night. If I talked to people they just laughed or smirked at me. It was horrible.

And then I got a job in a shop serving customers. Honest to god, it scared me to death. Having to talk to people all day. It was exhausting and I hated it and people starred at me and laughed. But over the years my confidence grew and I find it easy now. I enjoy it too, talking to people. I suggest you do something like this. A charity shop perhaps ? Something to get you talking to people.
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#19
(03-20-2015, 06:33 AM)BeyondShy Wrote: I asked her if she would like to go out for coffee sometime even though I just heard that the stuff gives her heartburn.

She said no. That one word almost knocked me to the ground. Actually she said "no, that's ok" while having a forced smile on her face and I could swear that if she wasn't working at the time she would have turned around and ran.

As soon as I heard the word no time almost stopped and the pain I had from the hernia surgery I had back in 2009 immediately returned. I apologized to her twice and then I walked away.

I walked around the supermarket for a couple of minutes. I didn't even know what I bought and returned home.

Driving home one thought kept on going through my mind over and over. I never should have said a word.
Are you kidding me? That's the best experience you could have at this point.

So what if she said 'No'? Yeah, it hurts. But you got over it didn't you?
But you know what? I couldn't even ask girls out at the point you're at. Every time I got close to a girl I'd get so silent. It took several years of pushing myself to even open up to people (just a little bit).

And you took the step to ask a girl out after just a little bit of advice? You've got courage. Don't you dare say you shouldn't have said anything. You need to do it more. Get hurt more, it's okay, it really is. Because eventually you'll meet someone who will say 'Yes' and it will make every 'No' completely worth it.

But to be honest, it was a bit silly to ask her to coffee right after she said she didn't like it.
Remember to LISTEN to what she has to say before you ask - listening is pretty important to girls. Wink

If you do really think about the situation, Why would she have remembered you after two weeks just because of your tooth? She probably sees so many other customers.
She either has an amazing memory or maybe she really did think you were interesting. Maybe she would have said Yes if you had 'actually' been listening to her.
Know this sounds awful, but it might be worth asking her again. What's the worst that could happen? She might say 'No' again? Maybe the hernia might come back but later you can have a laugh about it. Taking a moment to laugh at yourself is very important. It keeps your spirits high.

Take more leaps! It's worth it, I promise!
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#20
(03-20-2015, 07:04 AM)Triple Bogey Wrote: I was like you 20 years ago, everything the same. The nights out you describe; I used to stand by myself all night. If I talked to people they just laughed or smirked at me. It was horrible.

I used to just stand there and watch them do this but as the years have gone on I get mad now.


(03-20-2015, 07:04 AM)Triple Bogey Wrote: And then I got a job in a shop serving customers. Honest to god, it scared me to death. Having to talk to people all day. It was exhausting and I hated it and people starred at me and laughed. But over the years my confidence grew and I find it easy now. I enjoy it too, talking to people. I suggest you do something like this. A charity shop perhaps ? Something to get you talking to people.

Not a bad idea but I have no idea if any of these kind of shops are near by to me.

Despicable Me Wrote:Are you kidding me? That's the best experience you could have at this point.

So what if she said 'No'? Yeah, it hurts. But you got over it didn't you?
But you know what? I couldn't even ask girls out at the point you're at. Every time I got close to a girl I'd get so silent. It took several years of pushing myself to even open up to people (just a little bit).

And you took the step to ask a girl out after just a little bit of advice? You've got courage. Don't you dare say you shouldn't have said anything. You need to do it more. Get hurt more, it's okay, it really is. Because eventually you'll meet someone who will say 'Yes' and it will make every 'No' completely worth it.

I see what you are trying to say but as far as this being a good experience for me let's just say I could do with a lot less of these. But I get it. I learned something.

I'm over it now but I keep on rehashing the entire conversation. I had to take this step. I didn't come here to post and tell everyone what the hell is the matter with me and then say to myself well, that's all I can do about it.

It's so easy to write about how I feel. I can stop any time, pick out the right word I want to say and then move on. Not when you are talking to someone face-to-face.

Despicable Me Wrote:But to be honest, it was a bit silly to ask her to coffee right after she said she didn't like it.
Remember to LISTEN to what she has to say before you ask - listening is pretty important to girls.

Sure it was. I see exactly what you are saying. But it was like this. I was so concerned on what I was going to say because I rehearsed it so much that I didn't know what to say when she said she didn't drink coffee. It's like asking someone you know who is a vegetarian to go out for a burger.

It was silly. It was stupid. It was me.


Despicable Me Wrote:If you do really think about the situation, Why would she have remembered you after two weeks just because of your tooth? She probably sees so many other customers.
She either has an amazing memory or maybe she really did think you were interesting. Maybe she would have said Yes if you had 'actually' been listening to her.
Know this sounds awful, but it might be worth asking her again. What's the worst that could happen? She might say 'No' again? Maybe the hernia might come back but later you can have a laugh about it. Taking a moment to laugh at yourself is very important. It keeps your spirits high.

Take more leaps! It's worth it, I promise!

Good point. I think maybe I'll return there next week and try one more time. What's one more emergency room visit?

Thank you. Thank you so much.
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