On-line daters watch out for "nice guy syndrome."

[VanillaCreme]

Or at least we were before I got mad at her.

And you got mad at her for what legit reason? Because not agreeing to be with you, or dating someone that you deem as being a "piece of honeysuckle" are not legit reasons. That's not your relationship. You have no idea how he treats her behind closed doors.

Skafish, I can't help but take note of these things that you're saying about women whose only crime may be taking an interest in you. You're kind of mean! Are you aware of this? You have every right not to be interested in them. You have every right not to be attracted to them. But couldn't your words be somewhat kinder? Maybe make it about you and not about them. For example instead of saying "so few of those people that I can actually have a conversation with are attractive" Why not say "I'm not attracted to very many of the people I can have a conversation with." That makes it about you, not about them. And also you might come to terms with the fact that your perception that these women who like you are ugly, dull, lazy, awkward, mediocre and losers is really just YOUR perception. This does not mean that these women truly are by universal truth, ugly, dull, lazy, awkward, mediocre losers. They are to you, not to everybody, and they probably do have value to other people. Couldn't you just say that you personally do not find them interesting, attractive, non-lazy or above mediocre instead of just declaring them as having all these negative traits as if these women truly have no worth or positive traits at all and even calling them losers. What have they done to deserve this? What drives you to insult them and say such mean things about them? Something inside me wants to defend these poor women.

I want to defend them as well. It's a shame. And people with this attitude, because Ska isn't the only one, wonder why they get turned down themselves. What goes around, comes back around. You don't have to like them, but there's no reason to insult them. You won't even give them the time of day, so why act like you know all about them.

 

[Case]

It would be like that film clip. I want to know the thrill of finding someone special, not the tired resignation of defeat.

You have a different takeaway from this scene than I got. I think you are mistaking the "settling" part in that scene in the same way that the character Natalie mistook it. When Anna Kendrick's character, Natalie, says that "settling" is a failure "by definition," Clooney's character practically rolls his eyes. As I did when I first saw this in the theater. lol

Natalie is a naive girl who followed a guy to Nebraska in the desperate hope that he "fit the bill" of her list of strict requirements for "the perfect guy." Then, when "the perfect guy" dumps her, she crumbles in the middle of an airport hotel.

Ryan (George Clooney) and Alex (Vera Farmiga) are far more knowledgeable about life than Natalie. When Alex's idea of an acceptable guy doesn't match Natalie's rigid list of requirements, Natalie says, "Wow. That was depressing." (One of the funnier parts of the scene.) She just doesn't get it, which is why Alex and Ryan look at her incredulously.

Alex is a woman who realizes that many of the things she thought were important when she was Natalie's age just aren't important at all. The only thing they agreed upon was the guy had to have a nice smile. Natalie will only achieve Alex's level of understanding by relaxing her list of "the perfect guy" or she will experience many more years of pain.

The fact is, this idea of "settling" is nonsense. If I want someone and I can get her, I will get her. Why? Because she'll want ME, and when I want someone who wants me, it's no harder to seal the deal than saying three words:

"Wanna do this?"

It's not that hard. If I want her and I can't get her, I move on and I don't look back. I don't obsess for a millisecond on someone who won't have me. I don't have a ridiculously detailed list of compatible qualities like Natalie listed in the film. That's where she fails, I think. I like Alex's attitude much better. It's much more relaxed and wise.

 

[Littlesecret]

Okay. I could do that. Let me rephrase: I don't think I am terribly original but at the same time, I don't have a lot in common with most people. Most people around here are either professionals that are into their jobs and/or the bar scene, TV, and sports - or they are other miscellaneous niche groups devoted to just one thing. I'm not a just one thing person though. So there aren't a lot of women I can have a deeper-than-small-talk conversation with. And of those few that I can, there are fewer still that I am physically attracted to.

I feel bad for some of these women too. Some are really out of shape and it's a danger to their health. I hope for their own sake they get better.

What's made me mean is that I consider myself at least half-decent, yet I'm getting passed over here. I've never robbed anyone, vandalized property, picked fights, done hard drugs, etc. nor do I want to. But the people who have are the ones who get first choice in life because they are oh so cool. It angers me, it's really started to jade me. I thought I was old enough and meeting people smart enough to not care about that image crap. And here it is. I feel like it's high school again, where certain people just get right-of-way whether they are good people or not.

She's not the only one, and never really has been. She was just the one I talked to the most and was the most interested in talking to me. There were two others I liked almost as much, but I met them both online as well and they are both also taken. One very much so, which sucks, because with this particular girl, I had the most interests in common.

But - she's one of the very few on the entire planet that I would want, yes. Who knows what tomorrow will bring but if the past is any indicator of the future, it's very unlikely. My friends don't know anyone of this caliber. I wouldn't say it's crazy to assume that I wouldn't meet anyone else I would like as much. I met the 3 girls I liked in 2011 and 2012 and have not met anyone before or since that I've felt the same way about.

As far as I can tell, other, equal possibilities just don't exist. I could go out with someone I wouldn't like as much, but it just wouldn't be any fun. I'd be giving up, I wouldn't really be excited to be there. It would be like that film clip. I want to know the thrill of finding someone special, not the tired resignation of defeat.

I don't think there's really anything else to say that others haven't. I would like to say though you have put this girl on the highest pedestal ever, I'm pretty sure it's hard to see any flaws she may have from way down here.
I've read many of your posts and you have quite an unhealthy fixation on her, I also think the fact you are so attracted to her has clouded your judgement and made you lose the plot slightly. I've personally never felt that strongly about anyone before because it's unhealthy, desperate and can severely damage your mental health.
In another thread you were willing to change who you are to be with her, which makes no sense because you said what a connection you both have, and a connection has to come from two sides so if you felt it's necessary to change yourself to be with her, it's not a connection. Before reading your posts I would have never told anyone to get over someone but you really do, desperation never won fair maiden and maybe if you started to move on with your life you would realise maybe she wasn't right for me. She's just not that into you and nothing you can do will change that because you are who you are and she unfortunately doesn't want that.

I wish you the best.

 

[ladyforsaken]

Ska, I didn't read every word but I get the gist of all the posts above me about your situation. My thoughts still remain the same. Also, if you don't give others a chance, you won't know. They may seem like the typical girl you may not like, but once you warm up - it could be a totally different story altogether. All I'm saying is, if you don't give it a chance, you won't know.

 

[TheSkaFish]

And you got mad at her for what legit reason? Because not agreeing to be with you, or dating someone that you deem as being a "piece of honeysuckle" are not legit reasons. That's not your relationship. You have no idea how he treats her behind closed doors.

He is a piece of honeysuckle. No one should be defending a suicidal drug-swilling criminal that gets by on "tough guy" image. I'm tired of explaining this and I'm tired of people defending or romanticizing people like that, instead of seeing them for the scum they are. No one should pay any mind to these guys, they should be left to play "gangster" by themselves, or with other idiots.

---

The fact is, this idea of "settling" is nonsense. If I want someone and I can get her

Well, when all you can get is honeysuckle then what do you call it? What do you do? When all you can get is honeysuckle, in your one life. All the while dirty, stupid, obnoxious ******** fly through life first-class. And all you can get is what they don't want.

Sure isn't very romantic if you ask me.

---

Ya know what, the hell with all of this. The hell with settling, the hell with limited possibilities, the hell with helplessly, quietly watching the lousiest, dumbest people get right-of-way. Call me obsessed, tell me I should quit, whatever. I'm not going to go through life pretending to be happy with someone who is just "the best I can do", watching the jerks have all the fun while I sit here sighing. I'm going to hope she grows out of him cause for now that's all I can do. And I'm going change my identity to someone who kicks their problems in the teeth and gets what they want from life. There are some people whose identities are deep enough and strong enough that they can attract who they want. I just don't have that identity yet. A "badass" is no competition to a guy of real substance.

 

[ladyforsaken]

Well, all right, all the best to you, Ska.

 

[TheSkaFish]

Well, all right, all the best to you, Ska.

Thanks. The way people are just makes me so angry at times, how some people just get whatever they want, no problem. And other people, like me, just get told to accept what we are given, take it or leave it. It boils my blood. I suppose I could just do what they are doing - get the right interests, get the right wardrobe, get the right attitude. But then I would be the thing I hate. And I don't want that. I want to beat the "bad boys" as me.

And then, I don't even really know for sure what I need to do to get better. There's so much uncertainty. What are the right things to do and why? Do they even exist? Is it even possible to get better? Am I going in the right or wrong direction or nowhere? Will anything I do even work at all? I feel like I'm trying to walk from one side of town to the other, blindfolded. I have to try something new because I don't like the results I'm getting. But there are absolutely no guarantees. Like, in my situation, I thought she was flirting with me. I thought I was getting somewhere. To me, in my mind, it seemed that way. But obviously something was missing. So I think, what? By how much? It's so confusing. I wish I knew for sure exactly who I could attract now, and who I could attract if I changed things. Then I could see what actions result in what potential partners. Right now, I'm in admittedly pretty bad shape. So I think all I really have the ability to attract are the lowest-hanging fruit, if you will.

The only "known" is what will happen if I give up, and I don't like it. I guess I could just look someone up based on my interests, and pretend to be okay with whoever I meet, pretend not to care about looks or intelligence or personality and just pretend to be okay. But I don't want to be just okay. I want things to be great.

 

[Case]

I hope you find what you're looking for, Ska.

 

[LeaningIntoTheMuse]

The problem I have with being needy, or being a genuinely nice guy, is that a lot of people tend to treat both the same.

I have an example. Back in 2005, I remember in the dorm I resided in, my neighbor played guitar and he had just broken a string. I had an extra one, so I gave it to him. He wanted to pay me a dollar for the string, but I said "don't worry about it." I genuinely meant that, I had this extra string and didn't need it (it wouldn't have worked with my guitar strings, since I had just replaced that note), and I didn't care about $.99.

Well, he made it out to be that he owed me, and started doing things for me to make up for it, even though I told him that it was no big deal. He tortured himself by thinking that I couldn't have just given him the string, out of a kind and non-callous reasoning, and that I was trying to get him to do me a favor.

I have other stories, that have supported this. In general, most people don't see a person doing something kind as being just kind. They see it as an opportunity for that person to one-up that other person. This translates to relationships, and is probably why most nice guys end up alone.

 

[Case]

In general, most people don't see a person doing something kind as being just kind. They see it as an opportunity for that person to one-up that other person. This translates to relationships, and is probably why most nice guys end up alone.

I see what you are saying. Nice guys will do kind things just for the sake of it, but woman will think, "Uh oh. Now, he thinks I owe him sex." Sadly, there is precedence for this because there are guys who do nice things NOT out of kindness, but in order to guilt the woman into paying for this kindness in "other ways." (Mostly, sex. Hence the male complaint that they paid for dinners and outings but got no sex in return.) These guys don't realize that money and kindness is not the real transaction in dating. The real transaction in dating is emotional. If the man fails to stimulate the woman's emotional core, then the guy is wasting his money on her. If he satisfies her emotional needs, he's on the right path even if he's broke.

The problem is that more and more ********* men guilt women to the point where women are fed up and are suspect of any nice gesture.

That's where the truly "nice guy" gets screwed and why they need to break out of the "nice guy" stereotype. Prove to the woman that you're not needy, not a pushover, not paying for dinner just to get laid. But also, nice guys can overcome the stereotypical "nice guy" image by making sure that the woman's emotional core is satisfied. Make her laugh, make her feel wanted, playfully demand that she pay for ice cream since you got the last bill, don't be so nice all the time, tease her in a flirtatious manner, always keep the interactions playful and fun, and be an exciting, interesting person.

These are not difficult things to pull off. But identifying the "nice guy" traps, and widening your net of dating possibilities, will go a long way.

 

[ardour]

I see what you are saying. Nice guys will do kind things just for the sake of it, but woman will think, "Uh oh. Now, he thinks I owe him sex." Sadly, there is precedence for this because there are guys who do nice things NOT out of kindness, but in order to guilt the woman into paying for this kindness in "other ways." (Mostly, sex. Hence the male complaint that they paid for dinners and outings but got no sex in return.) These guys don't realize that money and kindness is not the real transaction in dating. The real transaction in dating is emotional. If the man fails to stimulate the woman's emotional core, then the guy is wasting his money on her. If he satisfies her emotional needs, he's on the right path even if he's broke.

We're the "stimulation" for their emotional core, but we don't have one... that's how I read it.

The problem is that more and more ********* men guilt women to the point where women are fed up and are suspect of any nice gesture. That's where the truly "nice guy" gets screwed and why they need to break out of the "nice guy" stereotype. Prove to the woman that you're not needy, not a pushover, not paying for dinner just to get laid. But also, nice guys can overcome the stereotypical "nice guy" image by making sure that the woman's emotional core is satisfied.

Sure but there are other ways to be kind without appearing like you're trying to create obligation. If she interprets general decency as weak or "he just wants into my pants" or "needy" then that's her problem. What has "needy" got to do this anyway?

Make her laugh, make her feel wanted, playfully demand that she pay for ice cream since you got the last bill, don't be so nice all the time, tease her in a flirtatious manner, always keep the interactions playful and fun, and be an exciting, interesting person.

Again you make it sound so one-sided, as if it were up to us play our date like a violin. It isn't. It takes both making an effort, one can't be passive waiting for the other to entertain them. We're emotional beings too.

That flirtatious manner seems to work when they've already fallen for the guy, once the attraction has been established. For us it can lead to disaster because anything like that can be misinterpreted as aggressive or obnoxious.

 

[TheSkaFish]

Prove to the woman that you're not needy, not a pushover, not paying for dinner just to get laid. But also, nice guys can overcome the stereotypical "nice guy" image by making sure that the woman's emotional core is satisfied. Make her laugh, make her feel wanted, playfully demand that she pay for ice cream since you got the last bill, don't be so nice all the time, tease her in a flirtatious manner, always keep the interactions playful and fun, and be an exciting, interesting person.

These are not difficult things to pull off. But identifying the "nice guy" traps, and widening your net of dating possibilities, will go a long way.

No one has ever come out and said to me that I'm "a nice guy" but I do have pretty much the same problem. But the thing is, the woman connects to my emotional core. Do I want to sleep with this girl I keep talking about? Yes. Do I have feelings for her? Also yes. I enjoyed that I made her laugh and I enjoyed that she said I made her happy. I thought of her when she was friendless and alone, and wanted to protect her when she was feeling blue. It wasn't just me wanting sex, so it's not as simple as me trying to trade something for it.

Since I and maybe others reading don't seem to know how to connect to a woman's emotional core, could you elaborate? In particular, could you provide examples of:

-making her feel wanted

-not being so nice all the time

-teasing her in a flirtatious manner

-keeping the interactions playful and fun, and

-being an exciting, interesting person in a dating/relationship context

I'm not being sarcastic. I really am this relationship-clueless that I need examples. That's something else that troubles me. I'm almost 28 and never had a relationship or gone on so much as 1 date. Yet as a guy I am supposed to take the lead. By now a lot of women are much more experienced and probably write me off as not knowing how to steer a relationship, because I'm inexperienced.

It just seems to me that dating and relationships require a lot of micro-management of one's own thoughts and actions. It's like "well, I've given her 2 compliments but 3 in a row puts me in 'nice guy' territory, better follow up with something not-so-nice followed by a compliment and an innuendo." It just seems so complex, like walking on a tightrope or playing chess. There are so many potential problem areas.

 

[VanillaCreme]

I'm not being sarcastic. I really am this relationship-clueless that I need examples. That's something else that troubles me. I'm almost 28 and never had a relationship or gone on so much as 1 date. Yet as a guy I am supposed to take the lead. By now a lot of women are much more experienced and probably write me off as not knowing how to steer a relationship, because I'm inexperienced.

Gender roles... Wouldn't swing a bat at that if I wanted to... Anyway, they "write you off" because they're not interested, which they have a right to decide. I don't think it has anything to do with the fact that you may or may not know how to drive a male car. You write people off because they're not perfect to you. You really should sit back and observe your attitude about this. It's okay for you to do it, but when they do, it causes a complete uproar in your mind.

 

[Batman55]

Skafish, I can't help but take note of these things that you're saying about women whose only crime may be taking an interest in you. You're kind of mean! Are you aware of this? You have every right not to be interested in them. You have every right not to be attracted to them. But couldn't your words be somewhat kinder? Maybe make it about you and not about them. For example instead of saying "so few of those people that I can actually have a conversation with are attractive" Why not say "I'm not attracted to very many of the people I can have a conversation with." That makes it about you, not about them. And also you might come to terms with the fact that your perception that these women who like you are ugly, dull, lazy, awkward, mediocre and losers is really just YOUR perception. This does not mean that these women truly are by universal truth, ugly, dull, lazy, awkward, mediocre losers. They are to you, not to everybody, and they probably do have value to other people. Couldn't you just say that you personally do not find them interesting, attractive, non-lazy or above mediocre instead of just declaring them as having all these negative traits as if these women truly have no worth or positive traits at all and even calling them losers. What have they done to deserve this? What drives you to insult them and say such mean things about them? Something inside me wants to defend these poor women.

On this point, I definitely agree.

I felt the allegation that Ska was/is a potential stalker was simply callous, however.

You win some, you lose some

 

[TheSkaFish]

Yes, I'm mean. I'm mean because of what's happened, I'm mean because of how the attraction process works, and I'm mean when I see lousy people get whatever they want, and their very stupid and furthermore actual bad traits, much worse than anything I've ever done, are all water under the bridge. It's jaded me. Besides, being nice just gets me honeysuckle on. I've had enough of it.

---

Gender roles... Wouldn't swing a bat at that if I wanted to... Anyway, they "write you off" because they're not interested, which they have a right to decide. I don't think it has anything to do with the fact that you may or may not know how to drive a male car. You write people off because they're not perfect to you. You really should sit back and observe your attitude about this. It's okay for you to do it, but when they do, it causes a complete uproar in your mind.

Actually I think my lack of understanding of how I'm supposed to play my gender role is the cause of all this un-attraction. People in the modern era love to hate on gender roles but when you look around you, you see that the people who play their gender roles are the people who get desirable results. The ones who don't play, or don't know how to play, get "sorry, I just see you as a friend". I know it makes me the bad guy for saying it but it's true. I don't know how to play my gender's role - meaning, I don't know how to create attraction as a man. So every time I'm in a situation where I want to attract a woman, I'm just hoping for the best instead of doing what I'm supposed to do.

It's like I'm being thrust into a game of chess, and I know the objective but not the rules, nor how any of the pieces move, let alone actual tried-and-true strategies. I lose not for no reason, but because I don't know how to play the game. How can you win a game that you don't know how to play? Your only hope would be to just keep making lucky accident after lucky accident. The odds are near-zero.

I really believe that someone is interested or not for real, concrete reasons which can be understood and explained. We can group the ways people act into neutral, attractive, and unattractive behaviors - some people have different preferences but there are definitely some general concept that tend to hold true. I think that's the first step to solving this problem.

 

[Case]

If she interprets general decency as weak or "he just wants into my pants" or "needy" then that's her problem.

Nope. Men created her problem. She's only reacting to a series of bad male behaviors. It's up to the man to understand reality and not get trapped by the barriers that ********* "nice guys" have created for us. Men can either understand "nice guy syndrome" (as it's been repeated over and over in this thread,) and learn to avoid those barriers, or be constantly dismissed by an ever irritated female populace.

Again you make it sound so one-sided, as if it were up to us play our date like a violin. It isn't.

I never said it was one-sided. Women generally like guys who can lead, take control, decide where the date goes, and how to create rapport. So, it's a tango. I have danced the tango before (literally,) so I have some experience with this analogy.

As in any other ballroom dance, the man leads with a gentle but firm grip, and he guides the woman across the dance floor. (An effective tango dancer is not playing his partner "like a violin," either, but participating in a wonderful pairing of two bodies moving effortlessly on the dance floor.)

However, if the man dances with anything less than a firm grip, the woman will not know where the man wants her to go with her feet and body, and it will lead to chaos.

Translate this into dating terms, and it's like men being indecisive. If a man is indecisive, the woman either thinks he's flaky or unprepared. I've seen so many women write variations of "decisiveness is sexy" on their online dating profiles that I know it's a common theme.

Since I and maybe others reading don't seem to know how to connect to a woman's emotional core, could you elaborate? In particular, could you provide examples of:
-making her feel wanted -
Example: Saying, "Wow. You look delicious tonight." Yes. I've actually said that.
-not being so nice all the time -
Example: If you disagree with her about something, say so. Don't be an ******* about it, but don't lie and hide behind niceties because you fear she might get up and leave. And if she does get up and leave because you disagreed, good riddance. Who wants to date someone who can't handle a little disagreement?
-teasing her in a flirtatious manner -
Example: If a woman swears on a date, I could say, "I had no idea I was dating a sailor." With the smile, and given the right tone, she will probably punch me in the shoulder. (Trust me. You want a women to punch you in the shoulder like that. It's part of the back-and-forth of the flirt. But be mindful. Know the difference between a light tease and an insult.)
-keeping the interactions playful and fun, -
Example: Jokes, jokes, and more jokes. Joke about yourself, joke about her (lightly), joke about the bar you're at, etc. Learn them, say them, love them. Every woman likes a sense of humor.
-being an exciting, interesting person in a dating/relationship context -
Examples: Be funny, have hobbies, play sports, have friends away from her, and be busy. Make her know that you will not need her to be your entertainment 100% of the time.

I'm not being sarcastic. I really am this relationship-clueless that I need examples. That's something else that troubles me. I'm almost 28 and never had a relationship or gone on so much as 1 date. Yet as a guy I am supposed to take the lead. By now a lot of women are much more experienced and probably write me off as not knowing how to steer a relationship, because I'm inexperienced.

Look. I sympathize. But there are literally tens of thousands of books and articles on how to build rapport with a woman. If I were you, my first step would be to stop treating dating and women as if you were climbing Mount Everest in a blizzard without oxygen tanks. You need to be relaxed. Being relaxed makes other people relaxed. Also, women are not conquests, puzzles, or codes to break. They're people. People have needs. We all do. Figure out what women need and fill that need.

It just seems to me that dating and relationships require a lot of micro-management of one's own thoughts and actions. It's like "well, I've given her 2 compliments but 3 in a row puts me in 'nice guy' territory, better follow up with something not-so-nice followed by a compliment and an innuendo." It just seems so complex, like walking on a tightrope or playing chess. There are so many potential problem areas.

Again, it's not that complex. It's much harder when you're in one. Believe me. The beginning is the fun part. But I think you make it harder on yourself because you either over think it, or you see women as some grand prize in the competition of life. Stop that. Also, you admittedly get angry when you see "bad boys" getting what you want and getting it easily. Stop that, too. If a girl goes for a bad boy, consider her a fool and move on. It serves no purpose to get angry about it.

 

[ardour]

I never said it was one-sided. Women generally like guys who can lead, take control, decide where the date goes, and how to create rapport. So, it's a tango. I have danced the tango before (literally,) so I have some experience with this analogy.

As in any other ballroom dance, the man leads with a gentle but firm grip, and he guides the woman across the dance floor. (An effective tango dancer is not playing his partner "like a violin," either, but participating in a wonderful pairing of two bodies moving effortlessly on the dance floor.)

However, if the man dances with anything less than a firm grip, the woman will not know where the man wants her to go with her feet and body, and it will lead to chaos.

Translate this into dating terms, and it's like men being indecisive. If a man is indecisive, the woman either thinks he's flaky or unprepared. I've seen so many women write variations of "decisiveness is sexy" on their online dating profiles that I know it's a common theme.

I prefer not to think of dating as a dance where one person gets to sit back and judge the efforts of the other to lead. At what point is the dance supposed to end and people begin relating on equal terms, 6 months? Man loses confidence and will to take charge; instant deal breaker. There's no trust in that kind of relationship.

I get that nobody finds a serious confidence deficiency attractive, nor a walkover afraid to be themselves for the sake of agreeableness, but we aren't performing seals either. If a woman requires role-play or hammed up decisiveness to remain interested I consider that non interest. It's more an immature fantasy -the male equivalent would be a hot nympho who strokes his ego and gives him sex whenever it pleases him. Why take part - it's undignified and (ironically) quite a submissive role to play.

 

[ladyforsaken]

The way people are just makes me so angry at times, how some people just get whatever they want, no problem. And other people, like me, just get told to accept what we are given, take it or leave it. It boils my blood. I suppose I could just do what they are doing - get the right interests, get the right wardrobe, get the right attitude. But then I would be the thing I hate. And I don't want that. I want to beat the "bad boys" as me.

And then, I don't even really know for sure what I need to do to get better. There's so much uncertainty. What are the right things to do and why? Do they even exist? Is it even possible to get better? Am I going in the right or wrong direction or nowhere? Will anything I do even work at all? I feel like I'm trying to walk from one side of town to the other, blindfolded. I have to try something new because I don't like the results I'm getting. But there are absolutely no guarantees. Like, in my situation, I thought she was flirting with me. I thought I was getting somewhere. To me, in my mind, it seemed that way. But obviously something was missing. So I think, what? By how much? It's so confusing. I wish I knew for sure exactly who I could attract now, and who I could attract if I changed things. Then I could see what actions result in what potential partners. Right now, I'm in admittedly pretty bad shape. So I think all I really have the ability to attract are the lowest-hanging fruit, if you will.

The only "known" is what will happen if I give up, and I don't like it. I guess I could just look someone up based on my interests, and pretend to be okay with whoever I meet, pretend not to care about looks or intelligence or personality and just pretend to be okay. But I don't want to be just okay. I want things to be great.

Dude. Every one of us don't have or can't have at least something that we might want to have in life. It doesn't mean we stay fixated on what we can't or don't have. Life ******* moves on. I don't think there's anyone who has it all - in my life I haven't met one, if you have met one, I'd say that's bullshit.

We have no ******* control over who gets what in life sometimes, opportunities and sometimes luck just gets handed to us. That's what I believe. We are all coming from different walks of life, nobody is entitled to have the same good stuff and bad stuff given to them in life.

If you're gonna spend your time being mad at things you have no control over and keep thinking of everything that's going wrong and why and what the fresia is wrong with you - you're not going to get anywhere.

Sometimes you gotta just stop thinking back on the past and what could've been and just do something to kick a start for something to even happen in your life.

I think you know this. But I don't know if you know this. Until you do, really, I wish you luck. And my advice still remains, move on if you even want to find some slight chance at happiness again. You don't have to compromise yourself by doing so, you don't have to change your personality or character by doing so. You just move on, as yourself, and you'll attract the people who will like you for you - and you know what you gotta do to improve yourself.

I know this thread is totally not about your case but I just had to say this. But yeah, good luck.

 

[kamya]

You just move on, as yourself, and you'll attract the people who will like you for you - and you know what you gotta do to improve yourself.

In before "I don't want the women that like me for me. Those women are complete shithole hambeasts that only care about drinking and keeping up with the kardashians."

 

[Littlesecret]

Dude. Every one of us don't have or can't have at least something that we might want to have in life. It doesn't mean we stay fixated on what we can't or don't have. Life ******* moves on. I don't think there's anyone who has it all - in my life I haven't met one, if you have met one, I'd say that's bullshit.

We have no ******* control over who gets what in life sometimes, opportunities and sometimes luck just gets handed to us. That's what I believe. We are all coming from different walks of life, nobody is entitled to have the same good stuff and bad stuff given to them in life.

If you're gonna spend your time being mad at things you have no control over and keep thinking of everything that's going wrong and why and what the fresia is wrong with you - you're not going to get anywhere.

Sometimes you gotta just stop thinking back on the past and what could've been and just do something to kick a start for something to even happen in your life.

I think you know this. But I don't know if you know this. Until you do, really, I wish you luck. And my advice still remains, move on if you even want to find some slight chance at happiness again. You don't have to compromise yourself by doing so, you don't have to change your personality or character by doing so. You just move on, as yourself, and you'll attract the people who will like you for you - and you know what you gotta do to improve yourself.

I know this thread is totally not about your case but I just had to say this. But yeah, good luck.

Well said miss lady!