College Costs

[ghbarnaby2]

I am currently in school for my masters and will be applying to medical school later on in the fall of this year. I have watched the price of college in my small life span go up dramatically - and the value of that education fall just as dramatically. I was reading an article today and wanted to share it because I feel that it speaks a little to the craziness of college costs.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout...duates-why-education-cost-much-092117028.html

What scares me most about this article is that her parents make a combined 57,000 and make "too much" for her to get a full ride to a university. They live in Baltimore. A city. A big city. I don't know where her family was going to pull the money from to pay for this but apparently the school did.

At the end of the article, she laments attending community college over a four year university, I feel this issue needs to be addressed as well. What's wrong with a community college? Sometimes they are better or just as good as a four year university as well as less costly. Why are we not encouraging people to get into trades? Apprenticeships? Things of that nature? Have we made the wrong choice by focusing on the "you must go to college" scheme?

 

[EveWasFramed]

Actually, I was reading an article just last week that said that (here in the US) that a shift was likely going to occur...back to (at least in part) to more education and training for "trade" jobs and "skilled labor" jobs. It's supposedly all part of the push to bring back and/or keep jobs in the US...the "American Made" thing I think. I remember back the in 90s when the town I was living in got hit really bad with a lot of closed manufacturing facilities (mainly textile mills and the like). Parts of North Carolina (and likely all states who relied heavily on manufacturing) were hit very hard.

As for the costs of attending, normally someone my age wouldn't be very interested in this, unless they are paying for their children's education expenses.
However, since I plan on returning to school once my ex is out of the military, I've actually done a little research on this.
Luckily, as part of our legal agreement, he agreed to assign his Post 9/11 Education Benefits to me, in lieu of spousal support, and me agreeing to waive my right to his military retirement (I would have refused that anyway - Im not the one who earned it).
Basically, what those benefits will do, is enable me to earn a degree in a field that will help me to provide for myself and my child...so we can have a better life (financially). It will pay for tuition, etc. as well as a housing allowance, so I wont even have to work - I can just focus on getting the most out of my education and still have plenty of time for my child. I consider myself VERY fortunate to have access to the benefits. If I didn't, going back to school would be something I'd never be able to AFFORD.
With the progran I will be on, I can almost choose where I want to live even. The housing allowance is based on where I live - it's not a set amount. I can live anywhere in the US...I can opt for another COUNTRY even. I can live in Sweden, Spain, Scotland, London, Greece, Italy, France, China, Canada, Australia....pretty much any country where there is an approved school. I plan to make the most of it for Jaylen and I.
As I read the article you linked, most of what I read were things that I already knew.... reduction of state and federal aid to colleges, as well as students, the widening gap between upper and lower financial classes...yes, I think middle-class America no longer exists (at least for the moment) and any family still in that gray area in between kind of gets screwed. They make too little to afford to pay full tuition for their child, or make just a little too much to get any HELP in paying for it.
Also, the article makes a very good point about the fact that, while you can restructure some businesses to be more cost effective and efficient, it would prove kind of difficult to do that with the education system. Quality instructors deserve a decent wage. Those wages only keep going up. You can't really cut those costs without sacrificing the learning experience and quality for students.
I do think that colleges need to look at more ways of saving money, such as encouraging on-line classes, etc.
I know that most colleges have work-study programs, but something I noticed about a few colleges Ive researched is that all "able" students are required to contribute by working on campus a certain number of hours each week (one I recall was only five hours per week) in order to keep the cost of tuitions down by enabling the school to spend less of staff for certain jobs. I feel that idea has a lot of potential.
As for community or "tech" colleges, I agree that they are more affordable and as long as credits can be transferred and the quality of education is there, it would be silly not to take advantage of the cheaper tuition if you cant afford the state or private four year universities.
Im rambling...
Im also hitting "post reply" without proofreading, proving that I need to further my education. lol

 

[Dissident]

Blame the combination of employers' continuing trust in a broken educational system and the banking industry taking advantage of the opportunity to straddle the unemployed and desperate youth with life-long debt right at the gates. Of course there is also a fair bit of class separation encouraging this activity. Employers are actively excluding lower class individuals from anything that isn't menial labor by requiring that applicants already have a job, so it's not a far stretch that, knowing the high cost of tuition, employers intentionally select people who have college experience because it can be perceived as a sign of wealth.

There is big money in straddling a whole generation with debt, and they know it. It was the same thing that caused the housing crash, and it's going to cause an educational crash, as well.

 

[EveWasFramed]

it's going to cause an educational crash, as well.

That frightens the hell out of me, and it also makes sense.

 

[Dissident]

Yeah. Tuition and overall cost of living continue to skyrocket while wages remain stagnant or drop. Millions of college graduates are not finding work, and there is no system in place whatsoever to handle the oncoming catastrophe - that is, millions of graduates defaulting on their loans but with no bankruptcy protection.

 

[ghbarnaby2]

I agree with the "educational crash" sentiment as well. We are already seeing massive grade inflation; in high school we had honors and AP classes which just added further to my GPA as a result our valedictorians graduated with 7 point somethings, in college we have honors programs that are now ALSO adding to the GPAs of students as well as becoming a preference for some job markets. We already see the trend that you need to have a master's to get a decent living wage while a bachelor's only gets you a minimum wage living. *shrug* What are people going to do when these bubbles burst?

And as someone applying to medical school I must say this as well, there are way too little doctors out there to serve the community that's about to slam the industry. Educational costs, grades, prestige, and networking of your school (and yourself) may matter more than your actual ability. While I am not saying let's lower the standard for our doctors (there are some pretty low quality ones out there already) but we may need to come up with another way of approaching the situation, quickly.

There is also the "lawyer bubble" where all these people have law degrees and debt with nothing to show for it because they didn't go to a prestigious enough school. :/ I feel like we are going back to what I read about in the 70s, people with incredible degrees/abilities/education driving taxi cabs in a big city cause no one will hire them.

 

[EveWasFramed]

... that is, millions of graduates defaulting on their loans but with no bankruptcy protection.

That's something that I actually pondered the other day as I was reading an article about the rate of student loan defaults.

 

[Revengineer]

It's all about status. When people think success, they see somebody in a big house, with a shiny car, a loving family and a $100k salary. And of course, that person graduated from college... preferably an Ivy League. College=status=good, successful person. Who doesn't want to be a good, successful person?

As the status of manual labor decreased and all the factory jobs left the US, the value of going to college increased dramatically. Nowadays the purpose of college is no longer about exploring your interests and figuring out what drives you, but convincing employers that you are a reliable and responsible human being who deserves a job. The more prestigious the college, the more of those desirable qualities are assumed. That is why people will pay any amount of money to go to a "good" college, because their future livelihood literally depends on it.

I agree that if more folks were open to attending community college or going into trades, then the situation would improve somewhat. The high-priced universities would be forced to find ways to attract students again, by lowering tuition rates. But these alternatives convey no status and the people who go there are considered "inferior" by many. True or not, it doesn't matter. Culturally, nothing is going to change until something drastic happens... like another financial crisis.

 

[Dissident]

It's more about a reflection of class separation rather than actual expectations of efficiency and knowledge.

 

[Revengineer]

It's more about a reflection of class separation rather than actual expectations of efficiency and knowledge.

I won't disagree with that. Things are certainly headed that way in our society in general.

 

[Dissident]

Yup. I highly suggest you start learning a Scandinavian language and GTFOASAP as I am.

 

[Revengineer]

Or flee to Canada and develop a taste for poutine. Whatever the hell that is...

 

[EveWasFramed]

Or flee to Canada and develop a taste for poutine. Whatever the hell that is...

Fries and gravy. lol

 

[Dissident]

Canada is an improvement but not by nearly as much.

 

[perfanoff]

A president of a 2,000 student college makes more than 1 million a year. That's $500 from every single student a year that goes only in the pockets of the president, discounting the board of trustees, and other fat cats.

You Americans have to do about your being owned by corporate cats' situation.

 

[Dissident]

But we won't because we deify them and tell them they deserve it.