Self hate

[Batman55]

I practice self-hate because I deserve it. I'm undeniably low quality compared to everyone else. Even looking around at this forum, I've discovered I've less motivation and less qualifications than anyone I've ever come across here. It seems like lonely people are Lonely But Still Get Things Done, or Lonely But Smart.. neither of which is me... I'm Lonely But Gets Nothing Done.

I've no direction, no clear talent, no qualifications.

This is why I practice self-hate, as opposed to self-love. Because I deserve it.

Think anyone would ever want anything to do with me? The answer is obvious. So don't use that kind of optimism around me anymore, it only continues the delusion...

(Yeah, I'm in a terrible mood.)

 

[VeganAtheist]

I can't lie. I have a lot of self-hate myself.
But the difference is that I don't think I deserve it. I think I should show compassion towards myself.
I think we should all give ourselves a break and show compassion to ourselves and others.
Easier said than done.

 

[WildernessWildChild]

So get off your ass and do something without seeking reward. Don't seek reciprocity, just do it because. That's when good honeysuckle happens and you feel good about yourself.

As for me....I'm off to t.p. a neighbours yard now that they're sleeping. The whole neighbourhoods gonna get a grin tomorrow

 

[jaguarundi]

Oh batters batters, you can always pm me when you feel low, you know that!

So have a**hug** definitely get up from your computer screen, go for a walk or something, tidy up your place, anything really that you can look at and think, 'well at least I accomplished something today.'

Then come back and tell us you feel better. Yes? (Saying 'no' is not an option by the way unless you want to be a squished battered bat)

 

[Tiina63]

Hi Batman-I suffer from self hate as well, so can relate to you closely. It's a horrible thing self hatred, as it makes you feel that you are being beaten up and abused from the inside out.
It can be hard to find motivation when you are in a very low place and also, when you read of others who are more motivated, it does make you feel even less motivated to change things. But taking just one small step could eventually lead you to doing more, if you could only find that bit of energy to push yourself into doing one thing differently. If you don't feel up to joining a night class or a social group, maybe you could take a couple of tins of food once a week to your local foodbank? It is only a small thing, but you would feel you are helping someone and it doesn't take much emotional effort or energy.
All the qualifications in the world won't take away self hatred. Instead, they will make you feel that, whatever, you do, it is never enough, that you will never be allowed to 'rest' and to be accepted, and that you have to keep on and on stacking up qualifications one after the other in the hope that one day you will have done enough to be loved. I went the route of passing exams in order to be loved and accepted and it didn't work.
Having said this, I am glad that I did study as it led me to a love of languages which I still have, though if I had my time again I would have stopped after A Levels and not gone to university as it was highly stressful.

 

[Veruca]

*hugs*

You don't deserve that at all. The only people who deserve to be hated by themselves or others are the evil, cruel, horrible specimens who kill, rape, torture, abuse etc.

You shouldn't compare yourself to others....there will always be people who do it better, who are more successful, better looking. Its like what WWC said, you've got to just do things for yourself. If getting out of bed and brushing your teeth is a challenge and you do it today, then you deserve to pat yourself on the back (anyone who has been depressed knows that just getting out of bed is a huge feat). No one can know what you've been through or what its like to be you...so no one gets to judge.

None of this is easy of course, but everytime you feel terrible and like you deserve to be hated, try to remind yourself that you're not bad person. Look for people who will help turn your negative feelings around....we are always here....

hugs, hope you feel better

 

[Zett]

Hey Batman55, I've been there before and it sucks, but maybe there's a few things I can post that might make you think twice.

You gotta ask yourself when you start to hate on yourself, what benefit does this give you? Does hating yourself give you any long term benefit?

You might not have achieved as much as others. I used to look at my Facebook and Linkedin account and get depressed seeing how all my friends graduated and got good jobs. Progressed to nice heights even, and I know some of their titles yield them salaries in the 100k+ easily. Yeah I've definitely been there, nothing like knowing I was 25 yrs old, racked up a 20k debt from failing university for 7 years and having been unable to get a job or do anything at all. I escaped into games and thought games was the only thing I was good at. It wasn't until 7 years later from that point on I realized what I needed to do and realized the inaccuracy in the statement that I can only be good at games.

If this failure is similar to what you're facing, you don't need to spend the time I did wasting it away in an activity that didn't yield me any results. You can take a shortcut but you gotta start with the right mentality.

If you stop thinking about self hate and start thinking about what is only useful to you, you might find that it isn't as bad as you actually think.

You gotta realize that whatever you did or didn't do to get to this stage in your life happened for whatever reason but you yourself are not genetically flawed. You're a result of everything you've experienced which is probably a combination of good and bad in your life but it's your interpretations of those events that shape you. During your youth it was probably hard to get your self esteem sorted out and hard to figure out what you wanted to do with the rest of your life. I faced those two very problems for a long time and I didn't figure it out until this year.

If you accept that you're just a product of your experiences you can then realize you have the power to change your future experiences to shape what you want to be. You can improve, you can get good at whatever it is you want to take an interest in. Honestly speaking I sucked at every single activity I started, I was no natural at anything in my life. I started from behind but I realized if I paid more attention, focus, time and self correction on the way I could get ahead and I could make a difference. The thing about this strategy is that ANYONE can do it. This isn't specific to me, this is specific to just getting good at an activity or skill set.

So don't practice self hate because that's not useful to you. What is useful though is to practice making the best of what you are. There are people out there with less than you, go find them on google if you have to. I'm going to assume you still have all your limbs, compare yourself to "Nick Vujicic", it's people like this that should make you think twice about what you're doing with what you have.

If you want financial success and to start picking yourself up, then start thinking differently. Think about what you want to be and where you want to go, research the greats in the related industry, or you could research some people now and see the paths they took to get where they wanted to be. Late bloomers are good to look at just to see evidence of what is achievable. This is pretty much where I got my inspiration. I started with Eric Thomas who was homeless, took 12 years to get his degree and to become what he is now. Then I started looking at others like Gurbaksch Chahal, Robert Kiyosaki to realize that you don't even need to finish school or college to become successful.

We're all human and through life it's inevitable that 'honeysuckle' will happen. As long as you aren't dead you have the capacity to get back up and change how you think. If you start visualizing the pathways to self improvement and spend all your energy towards that goal I guarantee you it will change everything. Learn from your past mistakes and use it to your advantage, make the best of what you got. Self hate is an investment with no return, but self improvement is the opposite.

 

[ladyforsaken]

Batman sorry you are feeling low. I hope something can lift your spirits up soon. :\

 

[Triple Bogey]

I practice self-hate because I deserve it. I'm undeniably low quality compared to everyone else. Even looking around at this forum, I've discovered I've less motivation and less qualifications than anyone I've ever come across here. It seems like lonely people are Lonely But Still Get Things Done, or Lonely But Smart.. neither of which is me... I'm Lonely But Gets Nothing Done.

I've no direction, no clear talent, no qualifications.

This is why I practice self-hate, as opposed to self-love. Because I deserve it.

Think anyone would ever want anything to do with me? The answer is obvious. So don't use that kind of optimism around me anymore, it only continues the delusion...

(Yeah, I'm in a terrible mood.)

I hope you feel better soon.
You always come across as a really nice person on here !

 

[ardour]

Man hug?

As long as you support yourself or do your best to there's no reason to hate yourself.

 

[Rosewood]

No one deserves self hate. That's a lie we tell ourselves. We are given negative messages from the day we are born and we buy in to them. I love myself and I love life. O want that one person to share in that love. Family and friends are just mot quite the same.

 

[Batman55]

Thanks for all the kind words. I have to digest some of this before I can reply to it specifically.

(Sorry if it seemed I was just looking for attention.)

 

[thegreyman]

I can relate to how you're feeling. It bothers me that I cannot find anyone who suffers from the same social problems as I do, and is also equally unfulfilled in other aspects of their life. I look for others who have the same problems as I do, only to find out that they make up for it in other ways, where I cannot. I feel as though Mr 'lonely but talented' cannot relate to what I'm going through, and therefore I feel even more alone.

I used to fool myself that I was possessed of certain virtues, but no more.

 

[Batman55]

I can relate to how you're feeling. It bothers me that I cannot find anyone who suffers from the same social problems as I do, and is also equally unfulfilled in other aspects of their life. I look for others who have the same problems as I do, only to find out that they make up for it in other ways, where I cannot. I feel as though Mr 'lonely but talented' cannot relate to what I'm going through, and therefore I feel even more alone.

I used to fool myself that I was possessed of certain virtues, but no more.

The only compensation I can think of for the problems you and I have (if indeed you have the same problem) is to learn how to fake confidence. In this same forum often it's said you don't actually need value/skill to be confident, and I observe the same thing in real life, where people who I believe have no reason or right to act confident STILL do it anyway. That seems to work for them: almost always these same "mediocre but semi-confident people" will have a significant other or at least a past relationship/fling to speak of.

I take the view that confidence is an act for most average people, but an act that is easy for them to learn. So, what are the mechanics involved in learning to express confidence? Can someone like me, with social difficulties, learn to do this manually, on a conscious level? This is where I get hung up. I'm also aware of some very simple changes that might help, but I keep putting them off anyway, because I'm just used to the same ol' routines and can't be bothered. I guess that part of it is more to do with apathy...

 

[Zett]

True confidence is the result of positive internal beliefs. This is why it's difficult for someone who hates themselves to 'fake' confidence. It comes from the belief that the person has value and/or competence in the field they are exhibiting this trait.

This belief is usually founded on previous experience and interpretations of those events and this is why it's so hard for people to simply act confident if all their previous experiences have been viewed in a negative way.

The way to get around this problem is to believe you can improve and develop skills that make up for your belief that you have no talents. Almost everything in your life can be improved, to really believe you can't improve is a lie you'll need to break down. Once you establish you can improve yourself in any given situation given enough time with proper self thinking support, you can then start to believe in your ability to grow. This faith will form the basis for real and true confidence and as results get better you'll continue to reinforce your own self values to the point where you begin to exhibit confidence naturally.

---

Thought I should add, I'm a person who is currently fairly hopeless at real life interactions with people. The meetup yesterday I attended is proof of that but it doesn't deter me from trying any harder. Whereas when it comes to skype or pure online presence I tend to flourish much better, and get conversations rolling the way I want them to.

I think for me it's a matter of making my real life presence congruent with the persona I'm displaying online but either way I have to chalk it up to my lack of experience in reality. I had plenty growing up as an adolescent but not plenty with my new mindset. It's hard to give value to my older past experiences when my interpretations of my youth were colored by my immature views. What I understand now is that there's just so many things I am probably not doing right with my body language or eye contact that isn't giving the same sort of connective vibe. But my inner faith in my ability to learn and grow is what is driving me to continue to expose myself. I've been to 3 meetups, I want to do at least a few hundred more and learn from the best (the social butterflies of our world). I'm also watching videos of successful people, great speakers of our time and great thinkers too. I'm trying to absorb as much as I can from great role models and make it part of my identity. I don't think what I'm doing is specific to me, this is something anyone can do and perhaps even faster but that's not my concern. My only concern is to bring the best I can of myself to the table through self correction and supportive thinking.

 

[Batman55]

The way to get around this problem is to believe you can improve and develop skills that make up for your belief that you have no talents. Almost everything in your life can be improved, to really believe you can't improve is a lie you'll need to break down. Once you establish you can improve yourself in any given situation given enough time with proper self thinking support, you can then start to believe in your ability to grow. This faith will form the basis for real and true confidence and as results get better you'll continue to reinforce your own self values to the point where you begin to exhibit confidence naturally.

To believe one can improve, and maintain that belief even if one does not improve at all (or improves very slowly), that might be the direction for me to go in. I imagine it's all part of a positive mindset that seems to come easy for a lot of folks, even the mediocre; for some reason, even with very few prospects and low potential, these people still act as if they're valuable. To me that doesn't really make sense, where is the logic in acting as if you belong.. if you already know you have significant limitations in life?

But at the same time, it seems as if projecting unfounded self-worth, may be the only way for me to go forward. It seems it is in fact the default state for the majority of people--> the majority of people don't accomplish much, but still act as if they're the best thing since sliced bread.

As for clarifying this confusing line between natural and fake confidence, Zett... in theory it should be that mediocre folks are acting confident, since they do not and will not have a solid foundation of achievements to build natural confidence upon.

Although, this whole thing is starting to get a bit confusing, and I'm not sure if you follow my line of thought.

 

[thegreyman]

I can relate to how you're feeling. It bothers me that I cannot find anyone who suffers from the same social problems as I do, and is also equally unfulfilled in other aspects of their life. I look for others who have the same problems as I do, only to find out that they make up for it in other ways, where I cannot. I feel as though Mr 'lonely but talented' cannot relate to what I'm going through, and therefore I feel even more alone.

I used to fool myself that I was possessed of certain virtues, but no more.

The only compensation I can think of for the problems you and I have (if indeed you have the same problem) is to learn how to fake confidence. In this same forum often it's said you don't actually need value/skill to be confident, and I observe the same thing in real life, where people who I believe have no reason or right to act confident STILL do it anyway. That seems to work for them: almost always these same "mediocre but semi-confident people" will have a significant other or at least a past relationship/fling to speak of.

I take the view that confidence is an act for most average people, but an act that is easy for them to learn. So, what are the mechanics involved in learning to express confidence? Can someone like me, with social difficulties, learn to do this manually, on a conscious level? This is where I get hung up. I'm also aware of some very simple changes that might help, but I keep putting them off anyway, because I'm just used to the same ol' routines and can't be bothered. I guess that part of it is more to do with apathy...

It's true that a lot of truly mediocre people evince plenty of confidence. However, the way my life has gone so far, it would be a stretch even to convince myself that I am mediocre.

I've managed to learn how to speak to people with confidence if they approach me, but that facade very quickly crumbles when I wade further and further out of my comfort zone.

 

[ardour]

One problem is the tendency to overthink everything and read meaning into others reactions when it isn't there, whereas other average "low achievers" (your words here) do not.

Absolutely no idea how to learn or even fake confidence, but common sense would suggest it needs to form in the wake of at least a few good recent experiences. Cutting yourself some slack wouldn't do any harm either.

 

[Zett]

Are you so sure they're mediocre? Again this is another internal belief that may be in the way of your current thinking. How can you assume to know everything about another person? What you know about them is probably very little. Perhaps their upbringing has given them that value. It's a good one but it needs to be balanced by awareness and humility in my opinion.

In regards to learning speed, this can differ depending on personal discipline which dictates your state of attention, focus and reflective abilities. This can be trained and can be had, genetics has nothing to do with the acquisition. The big one that gets in the way of people learning more quickly than others is their lack of emotional control, such as the feeling of shame. People who are ashamed of performing poorly instead of focusing on what they can do better drag themselves down. If you are able to push aside your feelings of hurt and learn from your mistakes you can use your failure to propel you forwards faster than others who drown themselves in it. Every aspect including learning speed itself can be accelerated regardless of your genetic values. In fact you'll find plenty of intelligent people get stuck in their own way of thinking because they lack the discipline to push beyond these ego boundaries.

The fact of the matter is, regardless of your current state and regardless of people who are currently 'mediocre' in your eyes we're all human. You have to respect that value as a human. Humans have the capacity for greatness just not every human pursues it.

I think the big sticking point for you is that you believe talent or genetics has a lot more to do with success than hard work and self belief. I think this line of thought needs to be challenged. I know plenty of people who get stuck on that and end up doing nothing. But then people like this come along and show us that it is the opposite.



I think it's ridiculous to think he was born to be a yoyo master, this is skill developed from years of passionate work which culminates in the expression of his identity through one field of himself.

 

[Batman55]

One problem is the tendency to overthink everything and read meaning into others reactions when it isn't there, whereas other average "low achievers" (your words here) do not.

This. It reminds me of my learning-disabled hyperactive cousin. I don't mean to sound harsh, but it is clear that he has some significant impairments, you can tell just by observing him. With all the difficulties he has, it's amazing that he conveys the confidence he does... (I'll get into that below.)

The guy had his first girlfriend relatively on time, at about 19 or 20 years old, and here I am like a ripe tomato but still without any experience.

Two things he does, that I do not: Socially oriented. Not sure if it's the hyperactivity that pushes him to just talk to anyone, or if it's his nature.. but IT WORKS. The other thing, he doesn't give a crap how anyone sees him.. this is LOW SELF AWARENESS turned into a positive.

I've seen some folks where the low self-awareness just kills it.. I think you have to have a certain kind of personality, a certain outlook, perhaps even a certain appearance or "charm" to make low self-awareness work. Whatever that is, my cousin has it.

On the other hand: I have an old friend who had the low self-awareness and would talk to anyone, but almost everyone was turned off by him. Here we have two creatures who have a great difficulty in perceiving their self-image, one successful, the other painfully not...

---

I think the big sticking point for you is that you believe talent or genetics has a lot more to do with success than hard work and self belief. I think this line of thought needs to be challenged. I know plenty of people who get stuck on that and end up doing nothing. But then people like this come along and show us that it is the opposite.



I think it's ridiculous to think he was born to be a yoyo master, this is skill developed from years of passionate work which culminates in the expression of his identity through one field of himself.

It is inspiring, but my analytical mind must nonetheless challenge some of this. The guy in the video later on went on to become an engineer, which proves he had a solid intellectual foundation to start with. (Sorry, I just can't help it! )

Improving in most things requires discipline and the ability to take a punch (or a perceived punch) and get back up. I've found it's very hard for me to deal with those "punches" or "setbacks" in general, but especially in all matters social. Perhaps trying a different psychiatric medication, especially one that improves my horrific attention span, may be one way to help myself get over the hump here.

Having someone approach me, for instance, and I'm just zoned out and can't react in time... IME there's a definite element of inattention behind this tendency. Another classic example is someone trying to have a conversation with me and I lose interest very quickly and start daydreaming: then I have to ask them to repeat what they said. Either that, or it's too boring for me. I can't get myself to focus or show interest when it is expected... another byproduct of ADD or slow cognitive tempo, whichever you want to call it. I simply don't have the discipline to find a way to improve this naturally. The only other alternative is chemistry.