Doubt The Rabbit
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Yes, do enjoy it! 
Do Pickup Artist manuals work?
- Thread starter LeaningIntoTheMuse
- Start date
Help Support Loneliness, Depression & Relationship Forum:
AFrozenSoul
Well-known member
This thread is making me want to give PUA a serious try. That way I can come here and say yes it did work.
AFrozenSoul said:
Same here, makes me wanna try harder
Kamya said "I feel like if what Solitary does actually worked, he wouldn't be solitary."
True, and I wouldn't take too seriously any of the advice on this thread (mie included). We are all here cuz we're loners, and that happens for a reason.
Girls will not tell you what they want, it real life. I think you have to figure it out, PUA is a good way to get started on the rules of seduction. Don't reead it like it's supposed to give you all the advice you'll need cuz you are gonna get dissapointed. It's just a start. If you wanna find love you can't stay somewhere and hope you'll run across someone with your same interests like in the movies, most likely that will never happen.
LeaningIntoTheMuse
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- Feb 1, 2011
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- 1
Nevermind.
F
Frito Bandito
Guest
It's funny.
Most, if not **** near all, of the people responding in this thread have never seriously picked up a book with the term "PUA" in the title and read it cover to cover.
If they had, they wouldn't be saying the things they are saying.
Saying "PUA is bad!" is like saying "Food is bad!"
Well, yah, food IS bad if you eat too **** much of it or eat the wrong types.
Food is also good, REAL good, in fact, you need it to live!
PUA is a blanket term for learning how to attract women.
Period.
That's it, folks.
There are books out there that give you canned lines and phrases, and tell you exactly what to do in every situation to manipulate things to your liking.
However, the MAJORITY of the material that I have encountered (and studied extensively I might add) follows these themes:
- Learning to be confident
- Learning to communicate better
- Learning to be stylish and bold in your appearance and attire
- Learning to be clean, hygenic, and take pride in your appearance
- Learning to understand how women communicate emotionally
- Learning to reduce, handle, and eliminate conflict in a sane fashion
- Learning to NOT be a needy or obsessive person, being independent and therefore "healthier" in your mindframe
- Learning to respect women and ALWAYS leave them better than you found them
I do not practice PUA, because I don't want to "pick women up". I want one woman to love. Period.
But anyone who argues that those things I just listed are somehow wrong...is...well...(fill in the blank).
A lot of the material you will find while researching PUA (and yes, there will be some bad, very very bad) is waaaay better than the stupid politically-correct dating books that basically tell men how to endlessly cater to women and therefore become the thing they despise the most: needy little boys.
To the OP, make your own decisions, do your own research. Do not listen to a million comments by people who don't know what they are talking about.
Most, if not **** near all, of the people responding in this thread have never seriously picked up a book with the term "PUA" in the title and read it cover to cover.
If they had, they wouldn't be saying the things they are saying.
Saying "PUA is bad!" is like saying "Food is bad!"
Well, yah, food IS bad if you eat too **** much of it or eat the wrong types.
Food is also good, REAL good, in fact, you need it to live!
PUA is a blanket term for learning how to attract women.
Period.
That's it, folks.
There are books out there that give you canned lines and phrases, and tell you exactly what to do in every situation to manipulate things to your liking.
However, the MAJORITY of the material that I have encountered (and studied extensively I might add) follows these themes:
- Learning to be confident
- Learning to communicate better
- Learning to be stylish and bold in your appearance and attire
- Learning to be clean, hygenic, and take pride in your appearance
- Learning to understand how women communicate emotionally
- Learning to reduce, handle, and eliminate conflict in a sane fashion
- Learning to NOT be a needy or obsessive person, being independent and therefore "healthier" in your mindframe
- Learning to respect women and ALWAYS leave them better than you found them
I do not practice PUA, because I don't want to "pick women up". I want one woman to love. Period.
But anyone who argues that those things I just listed are somehow wrong...is...well...(fill in the blank).
A lot of the material you will find while researching PUA (and yes, there will be some bad, very very bad) is waaaay better than the stupid politically-correct dating books that basically tell men how to endlessly cater to women and therefore become the thing they despise the most: needy little boys.
To the OP, make your own decisions, do your own research. Do not listen to a million comments by people who don't know what they are talking about.
Astral_Punisher
Well-known member
Doubt The Rabbit said:
I disagree. Reading anything will further knowledge in the area of expression. I have read nearly all of 'The Game' book, and I have found it insightful for my situation. I gained from reading it. According to you wording here, I have not. I disagree with this.
Damning anything with the generalization that 'PUA are bad', especially without READING the books in their entirety is a blind decision, and without knowledgeable basis. I also disagree with this.
kamya said:
I would agree with this. Most of the 'PUA' books are primarily about refocusing negative, nervous energy into something useful. While the primary objective is often 'getting laid', this does NOT mean that the lessons of the book are useless for re-focusing this negative, nervous energy into something like being 'interesting' or not 'falling all over ones-self' in the presence of a potential mating partner.
Doubt The Rabbit said:
I do not disagree with Solitary's technique.
He has a date, and I am not only glad, I am very happy for him, and I wish him THE BEST OF LUCK on his date!
Frito Bandito said:
I strongly agree with this.
Any source of knowledge that helps a person find a mate is useful, and 'PUA' books fall under this category to me.
I do not believe that they are a 'bible' or a 'rulebook', but they share stories and useful techniques for improving a person's chances of finding a partner.
In my opinion, every ounce of knowledge on a subject, does indeed 'help'.
Doubt The Rabbit said:
I think everyone can agree that men are more often unpleasant then women.
Now, this makes me question why anyone would want a man to not learn how to be better for his partner?
I believe that the 'get-laid' 'PUA' materials are a low-brow way of making this happen. I Strongly do not believe that they solve men being jerks, or opinionated, or rude. But they make them a little less focused on themselves, and a little more focused on other people.
I also believe that Solitary has worked VERY hard to get this date, but I also believe that there might have been a little luck (or advice/knowledge/ALL) that helped as well.
We are all barrels, and every ounce of knowledge helps up become a full, rounded barrel (person).
Why remove the chance to learn something?
I would strongly advise the OP to read as much as they are comfortable about relationships, from many, varied sources.
I find that the more I know about a topic, the more comfortable I am, and I believe that makes for a more natural, honest relationship.
Again, Good Luck on the date, Solitary - My wishes will be with you, and let us know how it goes!
LeaningIntoTheMuse
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2011
- Messages
- 5,133
- Reaction score
- 1
That makes me feel better, Astral.
I actually have "The Game" on my iPhone. I also have two books, one labeled "The Shy Dater", and another, "Dating for Dummies."
I will read all three, and then see if it helps me any. I did start to read some of Mystery's ebook, but I was turned off by the misogyny. I guess there was some truth in there, but I had some problems with it.
I actually have "The Game" on my iPhone. I also have two books, one labeled "The Shy Dater", and another, "Dating for Dummies."
I will read all three, and then see if it helps me any. I did start to read some of Mystery's ebook, but I was turned off by the misogyny. I guess there was some truth in there, but I had some problems with it.
kamya
Well-known member
Inner Game
^ Is a decent resource for anyone wanting to improve themselves when it comes to confidence/anxiety. It would be very hard to not find something useful in that list. Not all of it has to speak to you for you to get something out of it.
This is another decent compilation of material to graze through.
I also like THIS one.
This podcast episode might be useful to some members thinking about learning about this kind of thing. It won't hurt.
^ Is a decent resource for anyone wanting to improve themselves when it comes to confidence/anxiety. It would be very hard to not find something useful in that list. Not all of it has to speak to you for you to get something out of it.
This is another decent compilation of material to graze through.
I also like THIS one.
This podcast episode might be useful to some members thinking about learning about this kind of thing. It won't hurt.
F
floffyschneeman
Guest
showing the real you is showing what you truly feel at a particular situation when you think it's right to show it. Being the real you is doing the things you believe in doing. Despite your changes as a person along the years or with the experience you experience, being honest to yourself is showing the REAL you. The real you is not a fixed idea of what you should be or how you should act, but what feels genuine inside, what you feels right for you and what you believe in.
I think it's quite difficult to show the real you in topics such as dating/hunting and all these PUA shits cos most people get into it blindly. Thinking like it's a game one has to master. You gotta ask yourself, do I really like this girl I find attractive or I just want to get a girl. It's pointless for guys to want to have a girlfriend and yet can't even say if they really like this particular girl they want to ''hunt'' for. And yet they claim that they are nice guys who would treat a girl right.
liking the idea of having a girlfriend is so different from liking this particular girl. When you like a person, you wanna spend time with her, make her happy and just want to at least be her friend. then if you have chemistry, things just happens. that's why a lot of relationships break up as fast as they start cos people these days want something they don't even understand.
Also,
I don't want a guy who knows how to treat women right. I want a guy who treats me right cos it makes him happy. And how to know how to treat a woman or any person right, treat them as how you want yourself to be treated. At the end of the day, human emotions are common to everyone regardless of genders. So guys must also ask themselves, do you want a girl who knows how to work her ways to get ANY guy she finds to her liking? or someone who shows she cares cos she really does.
also, I think bettering yourself should be done cos you want to be better as a person because you believe in that and not just to be a better potential mate to any attractive girls. So although these PUA books and tips could help, the reason why a guy wants to learn it is also important. We wouldn't want a once was shy and nice guy to be mr. libido cos he found the tree of instant esteem boost.
/rant
I think it's quite difficult to show the real you in topics such as dating/hunting and all these PUA shits cos most people get into it blindly. Thinking like it's a game one has to master. You gotta ask yourself, do I really like this girl I find attractive or I just want to get a girl. It's pointless for guys to want to have a girlfriend and yet can't even say if they really like this particular girl they want to ''hunt'' for. And yet they claim that they are nice guys who would treat a girl right.
liking the idea of having a girlfriend is so different from liking this particular girl. When you like a person, you wanna spend time with her, make her happy and just want to at least be her friend. then if you have chemistry, things just happens. that's why a lot of relationships break up as fast as they start cos people these days want something they don't even understand.
Also,
I don't want a guy who knows how to treat women right. I want a guy who treats me right cos it makes him happy. And how to know how to treat a woman or any person right, treat them as how you want yourself to be treated. At the end of the day, human emotions are common to everyone regardless of genders. So guys must also ask themselves, do you want a girl who knows how to work her ways to get ANY guy she finds to her liking? or someone who shows she cares cos she really does.
also, I think bettering yourself should be done cos you want to be better as a person because you believe in that and not just to be a better potential mate to any attractive girls. So although these PUA books and tips could help, the reason why a guy wants to learn it is also important. We wouldn't want a once was shy and nice guy to be mr. libido cos he found the tree of instant esteem boost.
/rant
Peter Lorre
Well-known member
No wonder so many men who try PUA stuff get 'friendzoned', they're looking for a possible mate. (lame joke, I know )
Also, I agree with Floff
)Also, I agree with Floff
Astral_Punisher
Well-known member
@Leanintothemusic
I'm glad I made you feel better. Made me feel better to type some of what I said out. I dislike when people generalize negatively about a topic, so I can't help myself.
I'm perusing these links, and I think they are excellent. It seems to me like 'The Game' but minus the conquesting ('get them to bed ASAP') aspect.
A bookmark and read, definitely.
@floffyschneeman
showing the real you is showing what you truly feel at a particular situation when you think it's right to show it. Being the real you is doing the things you believe in doing. Despite your changes as a person along the years or with the experience you experience, being honest to yourself is showing the REAL you. The real you is not a fixed idea of what you should be or how you should act, but what feels genuine inside, what you feels right for you and what you believe in.
I think it's quite difficult to show the real you in topics such as dating/hunting and all these PUA shits cos most people get into it blindly. Thinking like it's a game one has to master. You gotta ask yourself, do I really like this girl I find attractive or I just want to get a girl. It's pointless for guys to want to have a girlfriend and yet can't even say if they really like this particular girl they want to ''hunt'' for. And yet they claim that they are nice guys who would treat a girl right.
I do strongly believe that people should be honest to themselves.
But, lets be honest here - most guys are not trained to be nice to Anyone, let alone prospective partners.
Maybe they had poor female leadership growing up, or they 'hung around with males' too much to learn. Maybe they were shy.
This makes them unskilled/inexperienced in the arena of dating/mating/prospecting for a partner.
And cute, clumsy, silly guys are fun and can be very attractive, but when a skilled, attractive, strong, confident, experienced, entertaining guy walks in, he will be the one turning the heads.
And I believe that it's not the woman that turns away most of the time. It's the GUY. He is intimidated.
Why not use a book/manual/advice to shore up their skill/experience/confidence level?
I don't believe that people should use 'PUA' resources blindly, but honestly, if someone wants to use this as a bible, who is to say they should be stopped, or even 'ostracized' as some have said?
People are free to make choices, fail, learn, and grow. The alternative may be never finding anyone at all. I believe that that is the problem, not the sore hearts that occur from 'PUA's.
liking the idea of having a girlfriend is so different from liking this particular girl. When you like a person, you wanna spend time with her, make her happy and just want to at least be her friend. then if you have chemistry, things just happens. that's why a lot of relationships break up as fast as they start cos people these days want something they don't even understand.
Unfortunately, to know what you really want in a partner, you have to get a partner, and learn what it's like.
And, how do you find the girl that you have 'chemistry' with if you don't have the confidence to go and look, or the strength to talk to if you do know her?
I don't believe that it's fair to say that a resource (in this case, 'PUA' materials) is off-limits to someone just because the topic is unsavory to some. I believe that such resources (while not the best tool for a 'traditional dating scenario'), are useful to some, and if it makes the difference between a man saying 'Hello' to a woman he finds attractive, or not, then it has served it's purpose.
And lets be honest again - it's unlikely that a man's 'first' partner will be the partner they are with forever.
I agree that people are 'after something that they don't even understand'.
Understanding comes from time and experience, and that comes from having the chance to learn/love/be crushed and rebuild after. Sometimes many times in a row.
I don't want a guy who knows how to treat women right. I want a guy who treats me right cos it makes him happy. And how to know how to treat a woman or any person right, treat them as how you want yourself to be treated. At the end of the day, human emotions are common to everyone regardless of genders. So guys must also ask themselves, do you want a girl who knows how to work her ways to get ANY guy she finds to her liking? or someone who shows she cares cos she really does.
I am not speaking for all men, but I believe that finding a man that treats a woman 'right' solely to make himself happy (with zero ulterior motive) is uncommon. I'm not convinced that there are many people (of either sex) that feel joy only from helping others, with no expectation of reciprocation.
Also, why does a girl have to have only the skill to 'get whatever guy she wants' OR someone who 'shows she cares because she honestly does'? I know girls that have both of these talents. They have boyfriends that enjoy how their women can still 'seduce' them, but the girls are loyal and do care, and choose their men because of love.
I know you're /rant.
now, I will /rant as well.
@Peter Lorre
From what I understand, hardcore 'PUA's are looking for 'all or nothing', so I don't know if the 'friend-zone' thing even comes into the equation.
It's 'sink' to the bed, or 'swim-away' for them. lol.
I'm glad I made you feel better. Made me feel better to type some of what I said out. I dislike when people generalize negatively about a topic, so I can't help myself.
kamya said:
I'm perusing these links, and I think they are excellent. It seems to me like 'The Game' but minus the conquesting ('get them to bed ASAP') aspect.
A bookmark and read, definitely.
@floffyschneeman
showing the real you is showing what you truly feel at a particular situation when you think it's right to show it. Being the real you is doing the things you believe in doing. Despite your changes as a person along the years or with the experience you experience, being honest to yourself is showing the REAL you. The real you is not a fixed idea of what you should be or how you should act, but what feels genuine inside, what you feels right for you and what you believe in.
I think it's quite difficult to show the real you in topics such as dating/hunting and all these PUA shits cos most people get into it blindly. Thinking like it's a game one has to master. You gotta ask yourself, do I really like this girl I find attractive or I just want to get a girl. It's pointless for guys to want to have a girlfriend and yet can't even say if they really like this particular girl they want to ''hunt'' for. And yet they claim that they are nice guys who would treat a girl right.
I do strongly believe that people should be honest to themselves.
But, lets be honest here - most guys are not trained to be nice to Anyone, let alone prospective partners.
Maybe they had poor female leadership growing up, or they 'hung around with males' too much to learn. Maybe they were shy.
This makes them unskilled/inexperienced in the arena of dating/mating/prospecting for a partner.
And cute, clumsy, silly guys are fun and can be very attractive, but when a skilled, attractive, strong, confident, experienced, entertaining guy walks in, he will be the one turning the heads.
And I believe that it's not the woman that turns away most of the time. It's the GUY. He is intimidated.
Why not use a book/manual/advice to shore up their skill/experience/confidence level?
I don't believe that people should use 'PUA' resources blindly, but honestly, if someone wants to use this as a bible, who is to say they should be stopped, or even 'ostracized' as some have said?
People are free to make choices, fail, learn, and grow. The alternative may be never finding anyone at all. I believe that that is the problem, not the sore hearts that occur from 'PUA's.
liking the idea of having a girlfriend is so different from liking this particular girl. When you like a person, you wanna spend time with her, make her happy and just want to at least be her friend. then if you have chemistry, things just happens. that's why a lot of relationships break up as fast as they start cos people these days want something they don't even understand.
Unfortunately, to know what you really want in a partner, you have to get a partner, and learn what it's like.
And, how do you find the girl that you have 'chemistry' with if you don't have the confidence to go and look, or the strength to talk to if you do know her?
I don't believe that it's fair to say that a resource (in this case, 'PUA' materials) is off-limits to someone just because the topic is unsavory to some. I believe that such resources (while not the best tool for a 'traditional dating scenario'), are useful to some, and if it makes the difference between a man saying 'Hello' to a woman he finds attractive, or not, then it has served it's purpose.
And lets be honest again - it's unlikely that a man's 'first' partner will be the partner they are with forever.
I agree that people are 'after something that they don't even understand'.
Understanding comes from time and experience, and that comes from having the chance to learn/love/be crushed and rebuild after. Sometimes many times in a row.
I don't want a guy who knows how to treat women right. I want a guy who treats me right cos it makes him happy. And how to know how to treat a woman or any person right, treat them as how you want yourself to be treated. At the end of the day, human emotions are common to everyone regardless of genders. So guys must also ask themselves, do you want a girl who knows how to work her ways to get ANY guy she finds to her liking? or someone who shows she cares cos she really does.
I am not speaking for all men, but I believe that finding a man that treats a woman 'right' solely to make himself happy (with zero ulterior motive) is uncommon. I'm not convinced that there are many people (of either sex) that feel joy only from helping others, with no expectation of reciprocation.
Also, why does a girl have to have only the skill to 'get whatever guy she wants' OR someone who 'shows she cares because she honestly does'? I know girls that have both of these talents. They have boyfriends that enjoy how their women can still 'seduce' them, but the girls are loyal and do care, and choose their men because of love.
I know you're /rant.
now, I will /rant as well.
@Peter Lorre
From what I understand, hardcore 'PUA's are looking for 'all or nothing', so I don't know if the 'friend-zone' thing even comes into the equation.
It's 'sink' to the bed, or 'swim-away' for them. lol.
F
floffyschneeman
Guest
Astral_Punisher said:@Leanintothemusic
I'm glad I made you feel better. Made me feel better to type some of what I said out. I dislike when people generalize negatively about a topic, so I can't help myself.
kamya said:
I'm perusing these links, and I think they are excellent. It seems to me like 'The Game' but minus the conquesting ('get them to bed ASAP') aspect.
A bookmark and read, definitely.
@floffyschneeman
showing the real you is showing what you truly feel at a particular situation when you think it's right to show it. Being the real you is doing the things you believe in doing. Despite your changes as a person along the years or with the experience you experience, being honest to yourself is showing the REAL you. The real you is not a fixed idea of what you should be or how you should act, but what feels genuine inside, what you feels right for you and what you believe in.
I think it's quite difficult to show the real you in topics such as dating/hunting and all these PUA shits cos most people get into it blindly. Thinking like it's a game one has to master. You gotta ask yourself, do I really like this girl I find attractive or I just want to get a girl. It's pointless for guys to want to have a girlfriend and yet can't even say if they really like this particular girl they want to ''hunt'' for. And yet they claim that they are nice guys who would treat a girl right.
I do strongly believe that people should be honest to themselves.
But, lets be honest here - most guys are not trained to be nice to Anyone, let alone prospective partners.
Maybe they had poor female leadership growing up, or they 'hung around with males' too much to learn. Maybe they were shy.
This makes them unskilled/inexperienced in the arena of dating/mating/prospecting for a partner.
And cute, clumsy, silly guys are fun and can be very attractive, but when a skilled, attractive, strong, confident, experienced, entertaining guy walks in, he will be the one turning the heads.
And I believe that it's not the woman that turns away most of the time. It's the GUY. He is intimidated.
Why not use a book/manual/advice to shore up their skill/experience/confidence level?
I don't believe that people should use 'PUA' resources blindly, but honestly, if someone wants to use this as a bible, who is to say they should be stopped, or even 'ostracized' as some have said?
People are free to make choices, fail, learn, and grow. The alternative may be never finding anyone at all. I believe that that is the problem, not the sore hearts that occur from 'PUA's.
liking the idea of having a girlfriend is so different from liking this particular girl. When you like a person, you wanna spend time with her, make her happy and just want to at least be her friend. then if you have chemistry, things just happens. that's why a lot of relationships break up as fast as they start cos people these days want something they don't even understand.
Unfortunately, to know what you really want in a partner, you have to get a partner, and learn what it's like.
And, how do you find the girl that you have 'chemistry' with if you don't have the confidence to go and look, or the strength to talk to if you do know her?
I don't believe that it's fair to say that a resource (in this case, 'PUA' materials) is off-limits to someone just because the topic is unsavory to some. I believe that such resources (while not the best tool for a 'traditional dating scenario'), are useful to some, and if it makes the difference between a man saying 'Hello' to a woman he finds attractive, or not, then it has served it's purpose.
And lets be honest again - it's unlikely that a man's 'first' partner will be the partner they are with forever.
I agree that people are 'after something that they don't even understand'.
Understanding comes from time and experience, and that comes from having the chance to learn/love/be crushed and rebuild after. Sometimes many times in a row.
I don't want a guy who knows how to treat women right. I want a guy who treats me right cos it makes him happy. And how to know how to treat a woman or any person right, treat them as how you want yourself to be treated. At the end of the day, human emotions are common to everyone regardless of genders. So guys must also ask themselves, do you want a girl who knows how to work her ways to get ANY guy she finds to her liking? or someone who shows she cares cos she really does.
I am not speaking for all men, but I believe that finding a man that treats a woman 'right' solely to make himself happy (with zero ulterior motive) is uncommon. I'm not convinced that there are many people (of either sex) that feel joy only from helping others, with no expectation of reciprocation.
Also, why does a girl have to have only the skill to 'get whatever guy she wants' OR someone who 'shows she cares because she honestly does'? I know girls that have both of these talents. They have boyfriends that enjoy how their women can still 'seduce' them, but the girls are loyal and do care, and choose their men because of love.
I know you're /rant.
now, I will /rant as well.
@Peter Lorre
From what I understand, hardcore 'PUA's are looking for 'all or nothing', so I don't know if the 'friend-zone' thing even comes into the equation.
It's 'sink' to the bed, or 'swim-away' for them. lol.
all I'm really saying is in order to know you like a certain girl, you have to get to know her beyond the dating field.. cos the dating field is a field where everyone try to show his/her best side.. Sometimes later on in the relationship you'd get to know the bad side as well, but the worst that could happen is when you wouldn't find that ''good side'' the person showed you the time you started dating. In order to know the person beyond dating is to get to know her as a friend. The problem with most young people today is that they want to find that person who would love their true selves yet they're not interested in getting to know each and everyone. Most people wouldn't bother to talk to you if they find you attractive or unsuitable as a mate. When you really think about it, the best way to get to know someone and find out if they are someone whom you can build a good chemistry or a relationship is to be friends with them first. Ask anyone in a stable and lasting relationship where they met their partners, not a lot of people would say in a club on a friday night.
Also I don't believe that all guys are the ''typical'' guys who are mean and who has ulterior motives in befriending a girl. I believe that guys with principles and values and who are good hearted by nature exist and I think guys should also believe that they more than the typical a-hole everyone would think they are.
Of course there is nothing wrong with using a book or an idea as a guide to better ones-self. But it's better to ask yourself why you are using this in the first place. Women aren't tools to help you develop your self esteem and they are not animals that you have to know how to tame or to lure. So, in my opinion, I'd really like that cute clumsy guy than the skilled, strong, attractive, confident, experienced dude everyone would drool over. Personally, ''experienced'' as a quality of a guy is something I really find shifty. I don't think I would be quick to trust those ''experienced'' guys
Astral_Punisher
Well-known member
@Floffy
*nods*
I agree that some women like the shy/quiet man; but that does not mean that most men realize that some women want shy.
The strong/experienced/'awesome' guy will make the shy/inexperienced/introverted guy feel intimidated.
Therefore, the shy guy will shrink into the shadows (without any interaction from any woman), and the proud, strong guy will simply be 'what is still available' for the woman to choose from.
The shy guy will leave the picture, and yes, the woman may miss him, but what is she going to do?
She will likely try to talk with the 'strong' guy, instead of talking to no one.
And people aren't only these two groups:
1) SHY, INTROVERTED, INEXPERIENCED, WEAKER AT DATING
2) PERSONABLE, EXTROVERTED, EXPERIENCED, STRONGER AT DATING
There are shades and shades of gray of all these, so even in a group of fairly 'normal, well adjusted' people, some men will be 'stronger' at dating, some 'weaker'.
I believe that the 'weaker' men will naturally ease themselves to the edges of the room, while the 'stronger' men will be entertaining, personable, and interest the greatest majority of the women (let alone 'people') in the room.
The 'weaker' men will simply 'disappear' from the picture, with no input from the women.
Believe me, I was, and often am, still part of this 'weaker' group, and I often hang out with men that are 'of this group' as well. This is really how I personally have seen 'free social scenarios' play out.
I do not 'blame' women at all, because I believe that the 'weaker' men are them, themselves, the issue. These men don't have the experience/strength/charisma/etc to go and speak to women.
As for getting to the point where a woman is a 'friend' that you still want to have more with - I believe that the majority of 'weaker' men do not have this sort of 'friend'. They may have female friends, but I believe that they do not see them as 'girlfriend' material (whether due to appearance, attitude, or something else). If these men did see them as 'girlfriend' material, then I don't believe that would have 'befriended' them; they would have tried to date them. If the woman has un-reciprocated feeling for this man, then the man has 'friend-zoned' the girl!
I would also like to say that I believe the vast, vast majority of men want a woman to have sex with, and that is the primary aim of the bulk of their female interactions. If it is believed that men who primarily want women in their lives to have sex with them is 'bad', then I believe you could count nearly all men as 'bad', including myself.' I believe that to think otherwise is counter to the base physical imperative of procreation.
Men generally want to have relations, and sex, with women. Finding a woman is, I believe, one of the most sore/stressful/intense issues in many men's lives. They would not go to all this work of finding a woman if they didn't have a good reason. The reasons is the unbearable weight in their guts, the inconsolable loneliness in their hearts, the unbelievable pressure in their pants. It is a un-ignorable biological imperative.
I don't believe the 'club' is a place to look for long-term mates. But I believe that it is an EXCELLENT place to foster and grow ones ability to attract and interest the opposite sex, which in turn, grants experience, which in turn, grants confidence. This confidence can then be used with 'good' woman that are in the so-called 'interest groups', so that the man does not act like a complete horses-ass in front the girl that he's had his heart set on for months.
*nods*
I agree that some women like the shy/quiet man; but that does not mean that most men realize that some women want shy.
The strong/experienced/'awesome' guy will make the shy/inexperienced/introverted guy feel intimidated.
Therefore, the shy guy will shrink into the shadows (without any interaction from any woman), and the proud, strong guy will simply be 'what is still available' for the woman to choose from.
The shy guy will leave the picture, and yes, the woman may miss him, but what is she going to do?
She will likely try to talk with the 'strong' guy, instead of talking to no one.
And people aren't only these two groups:
1) SHY, INTROVERTED, INEXPERIENCED, WEAKER AT DATING
2) PERSONABLE, EXTROVERTED, EXPERIENCED, STRONGER AT DATING
There are shades and shades of gray of all these, so even in a group of fairly 'normal, well adjusted' people, some men will be 'stronger' at dating, some 'weaker'.
I believe that the 'weaker' men will naturally ease themselves to the edges of the room, while the 'stronger' men will be entertaining, personable, and interest the greatest majority of the women (let alone 'people') in the room.
The 'weaker' men will simply 'disappear' from the picture, with no input from the women.
Believe me, I was, and often am, still part of this 'weaker' group, and I often hang out with men that are 'of this group' as well. This is really how I personally have seen 'free social scenarios' play out.
I do not 'blame' women at all, because I believe that the 'weaker' men are them, themselves, the issue. These men don't have the experience/strength/charisma/etc to go and speak to women.
As for getting to the point where a woman is a 'friend' that you still want to have more with - I believe that the majority of 'weaker' men do not have this sort of 'friend'. They may have female friends, but I believe that they do not see them as 'girlfriend' material (whether due to appearance, attitude, or something else). If these men did see them as 'girlfriend' material, then I don't believe that would have 'befriended' them; they would have tried to date them. If the woman has un-reciprocated feeling for this man, then the man has 'friend-zoned' the girl!
I would also like to say that I believe the vast, vast majority of men want a woman to have sex with, and that is the primary aim of the bulk of their female interactions. If it is believed that men who primarily want women in their lives to have sex with them is 'bad', then I believe you could count nearly all men as 'bad', including myself.' I believe that to think otherwise is counter to the base physical imperative of procreation.
Men generally want to have relations, and sex, with women. Finding a woman is, I believe, one of the most sore/stressful/intense issues in many men's lives. They would not go to all this work of finding a woman if they didn't have a good reason. The reasons is the unbearable weight in their guts, the inconsolable loneliness in their hearts, the unbelievable pressure in their pants. It is a un-ignorable biological imperative.
I don't believe the 'club' is a place to look for long-term mates. But I believe that it is an EXCELLENT place to foster and grow ones ability to attract and interest the opposite sex, which in turn, grants experience, which in turn, grants confidence. This confidence can then be used with 'good' woman that are in the so-called 'interest groups', so that the man does not act like a complete horses-ass in front the girl that he's had his heart set on for months.
LeaningIntoTheMuse
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2011
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Actually, I agreed with everything you wrote, until the last four paragraphs, which were pure poppycock. I am one of the weaker males: shy, unassertive, and too "nice", whatever that means...and I have plenty of attractive female friends. I have been friends with cheerleaders before. One friend I keep in contact with was the head cheerleader at my high school...and she still is highly attractive.
It doesn't make any difference, though. I am seen as either gay or asexual, due to me being not manly enough. I just wondered if PUA books would make me more manly, or make these women see me as a male equal, rather than one of their female friends (but a guy.) Sadly, it seems like guys like me are caught in the middle of romantic B.S., all of the time.
It doesn't make any difference, though. I am seen as either gay or asexual, due to me being not manly enough. I just wondered if PUA books would make me more manly, or make these women see me as a male equal, rather than one of their female friends (but a guy.) Sadly, it seems like guys like me are caught in the middle of romantic B.S., all of the time.
VanillaCreme
Well-known member
Do Pickup Artist manuals work?
No.
No.
LeaningIntoTheMuse
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 1, 2011
- Messages
- 5,133
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VanillaCreme said:
Then what does?
VanillaCreme
Well-known member
LeaningIntoTheMuse said:
Being yourself. 7 billion people, you're bound to meet someone who does like you for you. Just because it hasn't happened to you yet, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
Besides, all that PUA stuff is basically people pretending to be cocky and overly confident - which usually hides a deeper problem, PUA or not - and they all act like they just have "it", and if they had "it" in the first place, they wouldn't have to pretend.
Ak5
Well-known member
VanillaCreme said:
Yesssssssssss.
It's interesting that people who are against PUA are usually either women or men who have no problems in the dating game and are happily in relationships.
Weak men develop shyness and insecurity around women because in the stone age, a weak man who made advances towards women would have had a very real chance of being badly injured or even killed by a rival. Thus, it was in the weak man's best interest to avoid contact with women. Conversely, women preferred strong men because they would be more likely to be able to protect her offspring. In today's world, there's no real physical risk in approaching women. PUA takes advantage of this by teaching men who aren't strong how to act strong (or "alpha").
Most men are naturally strong, so this dating comes naturally to them. They see PUA as silly and unnecessary because they are just able to be themselves around women and women are attracted to them. Some men, however, don't properly develop traits like dominance and aggression in their childhood and teenage years. They are biologically male, but their personalities and physical appearances resemble per-pubescent boys more than adults. Indeed, few women want to date a 25 year old kissless virgin man-child. They might find him amusing, in a friendly little-brother sort of way, but they won't consider dating him. The man-child still has a chance on his own, but he has to make up years of lost time other men used to gain experience in the dating market. This can be hard to do because despite effectively being a child in the dating market, he still has adult responsibilities, such as working full time and paying bills. He doesn't have the leisure time that's afforded to children and teenagers that's often used for this purpose.
This is where PUA comes in. PUA is a series of exercises that accelerates the process of turning the man-child into a man. It teaches him how to display dominance and aggression. It teaches him how to show ladies a good time and how to give them excitement in their lives. It teaches him how to dress properly and to keep himself well groomed. It turns an unattracitve, pathetic man-child into an attractive man.
Weak men develop shyness and insecurity around women because in the stone age, a weak man who made advances towards women would have had a very real chance of being badly injured or even killed by a rival. Thus, it was in the weak man's best interest to avoid contact with women. Conversely, women preferred strong men because they would be more likely to be able to protect her offspring. In today's world, there's no real physical risk in approaching women. PUA takes advantage of this by teaching men who aren't strong how to act strong (or "alpha").
Most men are naturally strong, so this dating comes naturally to them. They see PUA as silly and unnecessary because they are just able to be themselves around women and women are attracted to them. Some men, however, don't properly develop traits like dominance and aggression in their childhood and teenage years. They are biologically male, but their personalities and physical appearances resemble per-pubescent boys more than adults. Indeed, few women want to date a 25 year old kissless virgin man-child. They might find him amusing, in a friendly little-brother sort of way, but they won't consider dating him. The man-child still has a chance on his own, but he has to make up years of lost time other men used to gain experience in the dating market. This can be hard to do because despite effectively being a child in the dating market, he still has adult responsibilities, such as working full time and paying bills. He doesn't have the leisure time that's afforded to children and teenagers that's often used for this purpose.
This is where PUA comes in. PUA is a series of exercises that accelerates the process of turning the man-child into a man. It teaches him how to display dominance and aggression. It teaches him how to show ladies a good time and how to give them excitement in their lives. It teaches him how to dress properly and to keep himself well groomed. It turns an unattracitve, pathetic man-child into an attractive man.
