Commentary on ALL

[VanillaCreme]

Stop the arguing. I don't know when or how or why it all started, and I really don't care. End it, please.

 

[TheRealCallie]

Thank *you* for showing class and not resorting to sarcasm or rudeness. Very much appreciated.

I sense sarcasm here, which would mean that you think BeyondShy has no class. Please correct me if I'm wrong....

By the way, you've contributed nothing but odd and passive-aggressive swipes. Please speak up if you like, but offer more substance than the quip.

You are telling him what to post and saying that what he does say has no substance. Sounds like an insult to me.

 

[BeyondShy]

And I'll continue to have my say, the same as you will. How many people are hurt and wondering whether they've done something wrong or posted something wrong? I guess they don't matter as much, because it's all about the people that are nice and never say anything mean....

Why bother? They'll ***** and moan about 99% of the stuff you post probably because you have the guts to say it and they don't. So they complain and bellyache and make excuses.

You should be able to post your feelings here without someone crying about it or sending you private messages complaining about what you wrote even though they never once talked to you. And yeah, that happened.

 

[TheRealCallie]

You can say no one is being called out, but they are. Do you have any idea how many people here are wondering whether they are part of this group that is "destroying" the forum? Did you ever think about how they would feel? Did you ever consider that a lot of people here don't know if they are doing something when they post and this thread will just show them that maybe they did because maybe they are one of the people you guys are talking about.

I have a feeling that these people will survive if that happens.

How do you know that? I'll definitely survive, but this is a lonely forum, some people that come here have just as many issues as anyone else. Doesn't mean they have to or will deal with it the same way, or even in a nice, respectful way. They do what they do, they do what they feel they need to do to be heard, to survive or not have to deal with the extensive pain and hurt they are feeling.

What you saying right there, is that THOSE people don't matter. Bull ******* honeysuckle, they matter JUST as much as anyone else.

Lol. People not being called out for bad behaviour probably has more chance of alienating vulnerable people on this forum. I think this thread is basically an acknowledgement that ALL could be a much better environment than it is.

This thread is just more drama, which will just scare the oh so vulnerable people away more. If someone has bad behavior, that's the MODS' job to handle and would be better suited BEHIND the scenes, not on open forum.
ANY environment could be better than they are, but so what. People are people, they have their own personalities and ways of dealing with things. Calling them out because you want to "protect" a certain group is wrong on every level.


To Nilla, sorry if you deem this as arguing, I'm honestly just discussing. I can stop if you think I'm arguing.

 

[BeyondShy]

And how am I running off if I'm speaking directly to you? Something doesn't compute...

Give it time, you will.

 

[lifestream]

Stop the arguing. I don't know when or how or why it all started, and I really don't care. End it, please.

Vanilla, neither myself nor reynard wanted anything but a polite, reasoned discourse on the current state of ALL. If you'll look back over the thread, you'll see that it was pulled off track by accusatory, reactionary posting. I would appreciate it if we could get back to the original purpose of the thread, and if people could maybe calm down and take a step back, we might just achieve that.

 

[Paraiyar]

You can say no one is being called out, but they are. Do you have any idea how many people here are wondering whether they are part of this group that is "destroying" the forum? Did you ever think about how they would feel? Did you ever consider that a lot of people here don't know if they are doing something when they post and this thread will just show them that maybe they did because maybe they are one of the people you guys are talking about.

I have a feeling that these people will survive if that happens.

How do you know that? I'll definitely survive, but this is a lonely forum, some people that come here have just as many issues as anyone else. Doesn't mean they have to or will deal with it the same way, or even in a nice, respectful way. They do what they do, they do what they feel they need to do to be heard, to survive or not have to deal with the extensive pain and hurt they are feeling.

What you saying right there, is that THOSE people don't matter. Bull ******* honeysuckle, they matter JUST as much as anyone else.

Lol. People not being called out for bad behaviour probably has more chance of alienating vulnerable people on this forum. I think this thread is basically an acknowledgement that ALL could be a much better environment than it is.

This thread is just more drama, which will just scare the oh so vulnerable people away more. If someone has bad behavior, that's the MODS' job to handle and would be better suited BEHIND the scenes, not on open forum.
ANY environment could be better than they are, but so what. People are people, they have their own personalities and ways of dealing with things. Calling them out because you want to "protect" a certain group is wrong on every level.


To Nilla, sorry if you deem this as arguing, I'm honestly just discussing. I can stop if you think I'm arguing.

Fine. We just disagree on this then.

 

[TheRealCallie]

None of this thread is off topic. You wanted discussion, you wanted opinions, you got them. You just don't like what you got.

 

[BeyondShy]

I would appreciate it if we could get back to the original purpose of the thread, and if people could maybe calm down and take a step back, we might just achieve that.

That's right folks, calm down, step back and agree with whatever these people are saying. Don't disagree anymore. That would be wrong.

 

[reynard_muldrake]

Thank *you* for showing class and not resorting to sarcasm or rudeness. Very much appreciated.

I sense sarcasm here, which would mean that you think BeyondShy has no class. Please correct me if I'm wrong....

By the way, you've contributed nothing but odd and passive-aggressive swipes. Please speak up if you like, but offer more substance than the quip.

You are telling him what to post and saying that what he does say has no substance. Sounds like an insult to me.

That's a reach. I only suggested BeyondShy speak up more. Far be it from me to dictate what he posts. My last comment was not an insult, merely a fact. Everyone else managed to keep it civil except for him. Like I said before, I will not hesitate to offer an opinion if necessary. This is one of those times.

 

[VanillaCreme]

Well... I think this thread will make people want to throw down anyway, regardless of that being the intention or not.

 

[lifestream]

Well... I think this thread will make people want to throw down anyway, regardless of that being the intention or not.

I hope you'll allow it to remain open, in any case.

 

[TheRealCallie]

That's a reach. I only suggested BeyondShy speak up more. Far be it from me to dictate what he posts. My last comment was not an insult, merely a fact. Everyone else managed to keep it civil except for him. Like I said before, I will not hesitate to offer an opinion if necessary. This is one of those times.

No different than the "insults" you claim where in the other thread....
Sarcasm doesn't necessarily equate to being uncivilized, btw.

 

[BeyondShy]

Everyone else managed to keep it civil except for him. Like I said before, I will not hesitate to offer an opinion if necessary. This is one of those times.

Yeah? I was keeping it civil. I wasn't angry with you. I wasn't calling you any names. The only thing I was doing was disagreeing with you like I will continue doing.

 

[user 115627]

I've been here for more than year now, so I can't speak for a change in general behavior or the enforcement of rules by the moderators. I've seen none during my time at least.

I agree with the idea of take-it-or-leave, cause it's not up to me to say who's a negative or a positive contributor and different styles of advice work for different people. I've seen people taking in advice which I personally regarded as detrimental and self-victimizing and even that is not up to me to judge. I only know I wouldn't want to be the one to push anybody off a cliff with my words and I can guarantee you don't need to break the rules to push anyone over the edge. Here we only answer to ourselves. If someone indicates he doesn't want me to reply repeatedly or if I notice whatever I say falls on deaf ears or is twisted around, the case is closed for me and I won't bother anymore. The rest is up to the mods to decide.

Sometimes there's more to a certain bitterness or frustration than what meets the eye - sometimes there isn't.

 

[ardour]

There are cliques in the forums, as in real life. If people want to pick up their toys and go, it's most likely because they think people here are beneath them, nothing to do with hostility. That's the reason people leave IMO, that or they simply feel they're not gaining anything more from being here.

 

[lifestream]

You make a good point, Rodent. The issue isn't so much that people are asking for nice suggestions only, but a consideration that maybe there are more people than not who are dissatisfied with business as usual here on ALL.

ardour, you make another good point. People will pack up and leave when they find that ALL is not to their taste and that's exactly what they have been doing, and the forum is suffering for it. While there are varied reasons as to why people leave, there are also more commonplace ones. How many of us have seen new members join, start fairly innocuous threads only to have them quickly become mired down in bickering and arguments? When this new member leaves because their thread attracted so much negativity, the question that comes to my mind is whether it all could have been avoided if people had been just a little slower to judge and a little quicker to try and empathise. That's the issue underpinning this thread: if people are truly satisfied with the order of things on ALL.

Anyway, thank you both for your viewpoints, it's very much appreciated.

 

[TheRealCallie]

There are cliques in the forums, as in real life. If people want to pick up their toys and go, it's most likely because they think people here are beneath them, nothing to do with hostility. That's the reason people leave IMO, that or they simply feel they're not gaining anything more from being here.

Indeed. I'd also like to point out that most of the newbies that register here never post at all. Or if they do, it's only a few posts and they stop coming. It has ALWAYS been that way, so it's hardly something new. It's not because of drama or those dastardly people who only argue and hijack threads. I have seen a honeysuckle ton of people make a thread and never come back to post in it again. Even when the evil people of the forum don't take them over.

 

[ladyforsaken]

Boy oh boy. What a mess.

I personally don't think there is any wrong or right here. I'm not on anyone's sides but I can see where each is coming from. While this forum is filled with a lot of people with issues that require some positivity and encouragement and I agree, this should be present, but seeing that real life people are on the forum, this forum is just how it is like in real life. Each person reacts to issues differently and each can only give what they perceive of the issue at hand.. and the OP of that particular issue should decide whether it's useful or not. I know this has already been said before this.

The OP could request for certain things they do not want to see or hear of in their original post so that the likelihood of seeing something that might trigger more negativity would be less. I'm sure most members here would have the decency to abide by that at least... most members, I say.

I also do note that sometimes "tough love" advice or suggestions don't help certain people, in fact, it only makes them retaliate. Different individuals means there should be differentiated approaches. I'm just reminded of how when I used to teach teenage kids, not all of the them respond to reverse psychology, not all of them respond to soft approach, or tough approach.. it all boils down to how the kid is.

That said, on this forum, we're mostly all strangers to one another, so we can't know what your personality is like to give a differentiated approach to your issues so I believe that's where people in general just give what they feel is best in their opinion. I don't think they have any ill intentions or mean any malice though.

I know that often times this would lead to a debate or discussion of opposing views and opinions, I suppose the problem really lies on how personally people take it or how civilised they can remain with one another without butting heads into another argument full of insults and words inserted into each other's posts, eventually calling for a thread closure.

Can't we just try to be decent with one another, accept that there will be differentiated opinions and reactions and move on if there is a differing view? I realise that sometimes, debating with certain people can go nowhere but in circles.

 

[reynard_muldrake]

Boy oh boy. What a mess.

I personally don't think there is any wrong or right here. I'm not on anyone's sides but I can see where each is coming from. While this forum is filled with a lot of people with issues that require some positivity and encouragement and I agree, this should be present, but seeing that real life people are on the forum, this forum is just how it is like in real life. Each person reacts to issues differently and each can only give what they perceive of the issue at hand.. and the OP of that particular issue should decide whether it's useful or not. I know this has already been said before this.

The OP could request for certain things they do not want to see or hear of in their original post so that the likelihood of seeing something that might trigger more negativity would be less. I'm sure most members here would have the decency to abide by that at least... most members, I say.

I also do note that sometimes "tough love" advice or suggestions don't help certain people, in fact, it only makes them retaliate. Different individuals means there should be differentiated approaches. I'm just reminded of how when I used to teach teenage kids, not all of the them respond to reverse psychology, not all of them respond to soft approach, or tough approach.. it all boils down to how the kid is.

That said, on this forum, we're mostly all strangers to one another, so we can't know what your personality is like to give a differentiated approach to your issues so I believe that's where people in general just give what they feel is best in their opinion. I don't think they have any ill intentions or mean any malice though.

I know that often times this would lead to a debate or discussion of opposing views and opinions, I suppose the problem really lies on how personally people take it or how civilised they can remain with one another without butting heads into another argument full of insults and words inserted into each other's posts, eventually calling for a thread closure.

Can't we just try to be decent with one another, accept that there will be differentiated opinions and reactions and move on if there is a differing view? I realise that sometimes, debating with certain people can go nowhere but in circles.

Thank you for the insightful post. This type of comment is really what I had hoped to see here.

I think the OP of any venting/advice seeking thread should also list attempts to correct whatever problem is plaguing him or her. If an OP gets as specific as possible, the thread has a good chance of progressing smoothly. Not that vagueness permits others to jump in with guns blazing, but it does complicate promising discussions.

You're correct in that many users don't intend to hurt or antagonize others. The thing is, intent only counts for so much. Personally speaking, I don't consider intent at all when I feel attacked. I'll venture to say many others are the same way. We joined the board because we already hurt. None of us need to encounter more in a place that's meant to provide help or solace.